49 Virginian and Convertible wiring

[william shippy]

On the 49 Virginian and convertibles the wiring run different then the 4 door cars. Is there a picture for the Virginian and convertibles anywhere that shows the wiring "Installed View" like there is for the 49 4 door?
  (see picture) "Frazer Wiring Installed View"

Also,

In the picture "Wire Key" it shows the color but nothing about the "Tracers" in the wire. When I make a wire harness what wire do I use? I see I can get one color or a color with tracers in it.
 
Any help is appreciated.

Wil in Whittier

[Fid]

Sorry I can't report that I know anything about the Virginian wiring and how it's installed but I do know that none of the wiring diagrams I've seen make any note of the tracers or lack thereof on the wires.

I had to make my own harness for my Allstate but luckily enough I had a used delapitated, faded one to copy and was able to identify which wires  had tracers on them.
I make a spreadsheet with gauges, nodes and colors on it.  It might be helpful to you if they used the same color schema on Kaiser and Frazer cars.  They likely did.  See the values listed for the HJ and compare to your diagram.  If the Tracer column is blank, that means there isn't one otherwise it's listed.  Also be sure to follow the gauge listing on your diagram because even on the HJ, the cars with Delco vrs Autolite use different gauges.  Example, the white wire from the starter button to the solenoid on an Autolite equipped car is 16 gauge but on a Delco equipped car it's 12 gauge. If a 16 is used where it should be a 12 it will likely not work well and could melt.  Good luck!

Color   Tracer   Gauge   From                                           To
Blk   Yel             10           B on Regulator                           30 amp fuse
Blk   Yel             10           30 amp fuse                           Hot term on headlight Switch
Blk   Rd             16           A on Reg                                   Gen Light
Blk                10          Grnd on Reg                           Gen case
Blk   Yel             10          Hot term on headlight Switch   Hot side of Ignition switch
Blk   Yel             14          Low terminal on dimmer sw           Lo-beam terminal on terminal block
Blk                16          Tail light terminal on hd light sw   Instrument Lamp
Blk                16          Tail light terminal on hd light sw   Instrument Lamp
Blk   Wht             12          H term on Horn relay                   Left horn
Blk   Wht             12          Left  horn                                   Right horn
Blu   Wht             16          Temperatur gauge                   Temp sending unit
Blu   Wht             16          Low side of Ign sw                   Oil pressure light
Blu   Wht             16          Low side of Ign sw                   Gen Light
Brn                10          Starter                                   B on Regulator
Grn   Blk             16          F on Reg                                   F on Generator
Org   Blk             16          Low side of Ign sw                   Instrument regulator
Rd   Blk             12          B on Regulator                           B on Horn Relay
Rd                10          A on Reg                                   Armature on Gen
Rd   Wht             12          H terminal on headlight sw           Common terminal on dimmer switch
Org   Blk             12          High terminal on dimmer sw   Hi-beam terminal on terminal block
Rd   Blk             16          High terminal on dimmer sw   Hi-beam indicator light
Rd                16          B terminal on hd light sw           Brake lamp switch
Rd                16          Brake lamp switch                   Junction terminal
Wht                16          Starter Sol                                   Starter Button
Wht   Blk             14          Low side of Ign sw                   - term on coil
Yel   Blk             16          P term on headlight switch           Parking light terminal on terminal block
Yel                16          Oil pressure light                           Oil pressure sending  unit

[G.B. (All Vinyl Dragon)]

Did,
Great Information !!!

[william shippy]

Thanks, Fid
This is vary helpful. I too have the old wiring harness to go by. It will be interesting to see if the 49 kaiser and frazer use the same wires with tracers. My frazer dome light wire is faded bad, maybe a cleaner will help.

Make me smile seeing how simple these cars are. Try to do this with a new car...  :^)

When judging does wire color and tracer get judged?

Also has anyone tried LED bulbs and how do they work? 

Thanks, Wil in Whittier

[kaiserfrazerlibrary]

With regards to judging standards as FID pointed out, wire gauge should be same as called out in standard K-F wiring diagrams for safety purposes; they used different types of wire based on current loads.  Same for color to allow someone else working on it later to follow the diagram.

The only information I have is a memo dated April 27, 1949 which was a cover letter for an 11 x 17 wiring diagram set for what was called "basic models" and dealt with 4-door sedans only.  I have also never seen a separate wiring diagram for Virginians but have seen the layout for the power window lifts in a Virginian which were vacuum rather than electric.  I would suggest you contact club member Dale Hammon as he's done 1949-50 Virginians over the years. 

[joefrazer]

Are you looking for hardtop or convertible wiring?  Vacuum or electric window lifts? The wiring differs and I have some of that documentation.

[william shippy]

Sorry so long getting back. Restoring a car is a lot of work...

49 kaiser Virginian, no power windows but in time I would like electric power windows.
I would be interested in seeing how a 49 Frazer conv. wiring looks like.

 Any 49-50 power window switch's around for sale ?

 Also 49-50 Frazer "Manhattan" Emblem's for sale ?

 And source for fender skirt gasket ?

 And source for outside body trim clips ?

 Thanks, William in Whittier Ca.

[Fid]

Here's one Manhattan script:

https://www.ebay.com/itm/384320888872?hash=item597b4f6028:g:qxgAAOSwgb5hEYxA

And here's a pair:

https://www.ebay.com/itm/184424870350?hash=item2af09431ce:g:vrYAAOSwMWhfS80R

[william shippy]

Thanks,
Notice the line under the Manhattan? If my understanding is right those fit the 47-48 Frazers and there a little shorter then the 49-50 Frazers.

[Fid]

Interesting - learn something new all the time.  We had a '49 Frazer Manhattan and it had the same one as used on the '47/'48s.  It was an early issue F496 so perhaps there was a running change because according to the '47/'48 Parts book, the "Manhattan" script is part number 202591.   That part number is also listed in the '49 Parts book as "Manhattan name plate 8" long showing a quantity of 1 on the F496.  But that same '49 Parts manual also lists "Manhattan name plate 9 1/2" Long" as 205587 with a quantity of 2 for the F496.  I have not encountered that yet so I stand corrected!