Darrin Door - stuck open, cannot close

[Darrin100]

hello again -- happy to report I was able to remove the passenger door just fine.

Unfortunately ..... the driver's side door is not cooperating with the grand plan.  (In fact, it's being downright disrespectful if you ask me!! )

Driver side door is open and will not budge shut.   I've tugged,  I've pushed, I've jiggled, I've worked it back and forth.  Nothing.

It's as though there's a mechanical mechanism locking it open.   If it was organic (mouse nest, corrosion, locked up runner, etc.) I'd think it would at least pretend to move, or give me some tiny bit of movement.....  but nothing.

I've loosened the Lower Runner Guide (removed all screws) and jiggled again.  I've re-attached the Lower Runner Guide to give the door some purchase as I tug at it.

Nothing.  Not moving.   I have no idea how to proceed.  Any suggestions from those who've been there before me?  As usual, many thanks in advance.

[Terry T]

the door has slides that run in the channels.
Must be a slide has gotten out of position and locked into the channel.  Nearly impossible to see the forward slides.
Most likely will require total removal of the door channels.

[joefrazer]

When the door is opened, a mechanical action causes the door to move away from the inside of the fender so it doesn't rub against it. Once the door is all of the way open, that action completes by dropping the mechanism into a detent so the door stays open. My guess is that something in the mechanism shifted and will not allow the handle, when moved, to release the door from its stop and allow it to slide closed. Since accessing the door guts isn't possible with the door fully open, you might have to remove it with the upper and lower rails to fix the problem

[Darrin100]

Terry, Joe -- thanks for your insight.

Total removal of the upper and lower door channels sounds like the way I will proceed. 

However,   I can't picture how to access the upper door channel.  (The lower is easy, of course.) I won't be at the car until Monday but I'll take a closer look at where/how the upper channel is fastened and figure it out.  Since the car is in pre-restored condition, I'm not concerned about damage to the finish, so that's a plus. 

After examining the car, I may ask for further advice on how to remove the upper channel with the door attached.   Thanks guys!

[joefrazer]

Another thought came to mind. Try removing the cover at the door latch - there might be enough space to get a long probe, tall paint stir stick or dowel rod inside the door to trip the stuck detent stop. There's a lot of moving parts between the rear and front of the door to work around but it's worth a shot.

The upper rail bolts are visible in the engine compartment. They sit high up near the firewall

[Darrin100]

thanks Joe -- I'll be getting to the car tomorrow and will give your idea a go.   I've got dowels here at home so I'll grab a few to take along.

[Darrin100]

I got the door out.  For those interested in how it happened, read on:

Recap:  Driver door stuck in open position, would not slide along lower track runner.  As such, I was not able to remove the door since the door must be able to travel fully rear-ward (99.9% closed) so it can be swung outward and clear the forward fender.

As suggested here by Terry & Joe, I removed fasteners for the upper track runner which completely freed the door from the body.  However I was still stuck since the lower track runner simply not clear the rear door jam.  I could not see how to get the whole assy out without radically bending the track runner and I did not want to do that.

So taking Joes next suggestion, I took a long, strong piece of thin wood and tried to release any mechanical linkage that might be holding the door in the open position.  With the door moving freely left / right & up / down  (as limited as it was) within the fender, I could get a good view deep in the pocket, toward the front.  Frankly I saw nothing mechanical that appeared to be holding this door open. 

I examined the passenger door which was laying on my workbench and I saw nothing that would explain why the door was stuck open.   Back at the car, I saw, deep in the pocket, a mouse nest.  It was right on top of the lower track runner /axle assy.  More and more I thought "This can't have anything to do with any sort of mechanical linkage. It has to be an organic third-party influence."

I took a chance and decided to use brute force.  I placed a thin piece of wood to protect the aft jam fiberglass and, grabbing the door firmly, sharply smacked the lower track runner against piece of wood protecting the aft jam.

Sure enough, after three sharp raps, the door broke free from the lower track runner and now slid freely.   Now I could bring the door full aft and remove the whole assy.

The jam was purely organic in origin. After years of mouse urine adulterating the parts, the lower runner was fused to the lower track.  And as you can see from these pictures,  the track is terribly corroded. I'm not sure I can salvage the lower track runner, but I'll see how it looks after cleaning it up.  May need to get one fabricated.

[rdgodwin1954@gmail.com]

Had to be stressful to solve the problem, but your details on cause and solution make great reading. Glad you got it free.

[joefrazer]

Do you use Facebook? There are two Darrin related pages with much more activity than here where you might find someone with a lead on new door track. Yours appears pretty corroded but you could try flipping the track over...the top now becomes the bottom. If the track groove itself is clean, it'll do the job.

[Terry T]

Joe is correct with cleaning and flipping

[Darrin100]

Do you use Facebook? There are two Darrin related pages with much more activity than here....

hi Joe -- yes I'm aware of those pages and have found them very helpful.  I guess there are two reasons I just posted here:  1.  I find the idea of a dedicated forum quite appealing (I am a member of one related to Cessna Cardinals and it's just a treasure of info and these forums search functions are quite helpful)  and 2. I just didn't want to post in multiple places.     

That said, I think I will post on the FB pages as well.... I am a big fan of those pages and understand your point about more activity.   Thanks!!

edit:  and for some reason the forum is not letting me post with images.... so I will revert to the FB pages for my next topic: body removal and bracing

[Darrin100]

Had to be stressful to solve the problem, but your details on cause and solution make great reading. Glad you got it free.

Thanks!!  I hope to be helpful to others as I progress down this road.  There's so much great info here already but if I can add some additional context/ perspective, happy to do it.

I may be posting on the two Facebook sites since this Forum is not liking me posting images today.....