Author Topic: What makes a Carolina a Carolina?  (Read 19204 times)

pnw_oldmags

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What makes a Carolina a Carolina?
« on: March 09, 2012, 07:37:33 PM »
Trying to make a list of ways to identify a 1953 Carolina...
 1 - Data Plate Model would be 538-1 or 538-4
 2 - Serial Plate would start with K538
 3 - Front bumper would have no bananas or bumper guards
 4 - No Script on front fenders
 5 - Headlight rings should be stainless rings like a Henry J
 6 - Steering Wheel should be just a round center
 7 - Only a Driver Side Visor
 8 - Only a Driver Side B-Pillar Light
 9 - No K plaque on glove box
10 - Hard rubber Steering Wheel
11 - Inside Door Handles and window cranks are like Henry J
12 - Hub caps can be full dish Ks or small center K Caps
13 - Steering Column not enclosed on Manual Trany like Manhattans are.
14 - NO stainless down the sides.
Thoughts, changes, additions??
 
« Last Edit: March 24, 2012, 09:22:14 PM by pnw_oldmags »
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kaiserfrazerlibrary

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Re: What makes a Carolina a Carolina?
« Reply #1 on: March 09, 2012, 09:32:40 PM »
The radio knobs should be same on all kaisers as they were part of the standard kit.

Be aware that 1953 Kaiser Carolina models were "eligible" for all accessory items that worked with a Kaiser deLuxe, including Wire Wheels.  The Confidential Bulletin announcing that accessory to dealers says ALL Kaiser models.

Best and easiest way to identify a Carolina is the door post tag and the serial number prefix of 538 matched by a body serial number that has the 538 prefix also.


pnw_oldmags

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Re: What makes a Carolina a Carolina?
« Reply #2 on: March 09, 2012, 10:21:56 PM »
The Henry J Radio knobs idea came from photo #3
http://www.hemmings.com/hcc/stories/2009/10/01/hmn_feature7.html
Look at photo #3 in this great spread.  A very nice Carolina!
« Last Edit: March 09, 2012, 10:24:47 PM by pnw_oldmags »
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Fid

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Re: What makes a Carolina a Carolina?
« Reply #3 on: March 10, 2012, 01:18:19 AM »
Those aren't Henry J knobs. Those are the knobs which were used on the 1949/50 KF radios and the 1951 Frazer radio. Rudy reproduces them so likely the owner of this car was missing knobs, which many are, and bought these from Rudy because that's what he had. The radio in that photo is the standard KF issue one of the era and would have originally had the chrome knobs.
Another thing that's interesting about that Carolina is it has a Hydramatic. Wes Durst has a black Carolina tudor which is equipped with a Hydramatic.
« Last Edit: March 10, 2012, 01:22:12 AM by Fid »
1953 Henry J Corsair Deluxe
Edgar Kaiser's custom 1951 Henry J
1951 Kaiser Special
1952 Allstate Deluxe

Need your classic car radio repaired? I repair vacuum tube radios

pnw_oldmags

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Re: What makes a Carolina a Carolina?
« Reply #4 on: March 13, 2012, 11:08:10 PM »
Kaiser Carolina Parts Manual 1953

The PDF of this 4 page Manual, small but interesting 
http://circlekf.com/kflit/PM/kfpm760/kfpm760.pdf
« Last Edit: March 13, 2012, 11:12:31 PM by pnw_oldmags »
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HJ-ETEX

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Re: What makes a Carolina a Carolina?
« Reply #5 on: March 15, 2012, 07:47:06 PM »
Jim:
May be you should ask the man that owned one. Bill Deloney of Prescott AZ had one and Del Fankhauser still has one (Lowell can comment on that).
After looking at these 2 Carolinas, I wanted to pull my hair out from the seemingly stupid way Kaiser did these cars. They are supposed to be price leaders. They should have had less equipment than the DeLuxe series, but that doesn't seem true. I could have removed $15 more (1953 dollars) of equipment on those cars. You DON'T want your dealers selling Carolinas; you want them to sell DeLuxes or (hopefully) Manhattans. Kaiser should not have made more than 25 of these cars, tops.
Studebaker had a similar model in 1957-58: The Scotsman*. This was a stripped Champion and Studebaker would not allow dealers to add any accessories expect for a VERY limited number. Probably because of this rigid policy, the Scotsman was a sales success (Hey times were tough for Studebaker and other car manufacturers those years so you have to scale back on what you call a success.) and that gave management the confidence to OK the Lark. 
Bill Deloney pointed out to me that the trunk lock on Carolinas is different from other Kaisers. I don't think that was a big savings.
* There was also a Scotsman truck. In fact more than 50% of 1959 Studebaker trucks were Scotsmans. All Scotsman trucks were 6 cylinder. If you have a 59 Stude truck with a a V8 it is a DeLuxe and not a Scotsman. And if it has a 289V8 and 4wd it is VERY rare - like one of 15.
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Fid

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Re: What makes a Carolina a Carolina?
« Reply #6 on: March 15, 2012, 09:00:57 PM »
You never know what some of those car manufacturers would do. I remember seeing a 1967 Camaro SS with a factory six cylinder engine!  The owner told me he bought the car in the early 1980s, noticed it was a tag matching car so, much to his credit, he chose to leave it alone. Very strange - who ponies up the cash for an SS and opts for a 6 cylinder engine? Del's Carolina is pretty true to what it would've been originally. He did add a factory radio and, according to the tags, it did come equipped with overdrive from the factory.  Weas' '51 Kaiser Special, which my dad dubbed "Lasagna" is a bare-bones Special with no chrome at all and yet it has overdrive and a factory radio. We have the original paperwork for that car, which was purchased new by a honeymoon couple in August 1950, and the sticker lists overdrive and radio as factory installed options on it when new. It has the early GE radio with the hump in the firewall. Pretty cool.
1953 Henry J Corsair Deluxe
Edgar Kaiser's custom 1951 Henry J
1951 Kaiser Special
1952 Allstate Deluxe

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kaiserfrazerlibrary

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Re: What makes a Carolina a Carolina?
« Reply #7 on: March 16, 2012, 05:16:46 AM »
Kaiser-Frazer Sales Corporation could have easily cut the price tag on a Carolina another $100.00 by rolling back the margin on the car (difference between wholesale and advertised retail price).   They could have done the same thing in 1950 with a rollback in margin on the base-line Henry J.   Hitting the dealer in the pocketbook would definitely be a better deterrant to selling great numbers of cars than things like Tim Bedford's memo on selling the car, or rather, not selling the car.

No Kaiser-Frazer dealer was expected to sell Carolinas in great numbers.  The car and its price was intended to get people into the showrooms.  Salespeople were expected to sell up to a Manhattan (forget the deLuxe) or down to a well-equipped Corsair Deluxe if delivered price was significant.  From what I can gather, it seems that total Carolina production (2 door and 4 door versions) came out to around 1 of these per dealer.  That way, a dealer could stock 1 car and advertise the price.

Check out what I wrote about the Carolina in my K-F book, BUILT TO BETTER THE BEST.

Oh yes, don't forget things like the Avanti that the Studebaker dealer in Thorp, Wisconsin had.  Forced to take an Avanti even though the dealer felt he couldn't sell one, he ordered the car with no options; it came with a 3-speed manual shift on the column!  For a number of years in the 1970's you could find the car at the OLD CARS show in Iola, still showing its original window sticker.

pnw_oldmags

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Re: What makes a Carolina a Carolina?
« Reply #8 on: March 23, 2012, 10:36:06 PM »
Found a Carolina in the woods and it followed me home.  It is in pieces but mostly there.  It will be an interesting restoration.
« Last Edit: March 23, 2012, 10:40:46 PM by pnw_oldmags »
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r1lark

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Re: What makes a Carolina a Carolina?
« Reply #9 on: March 24, 2012, 08:36:54 AM »
Alright, an overdrive car! ;D

Condition looks decent for being left sitting in the woods.
Paul
Winston-Salem NC
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pnw_oldmags

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Re: What makes a Carolina a Carolina?
« Reply #10 on: March 24, 2012, 09:18:03 AM »
Condition of body is great.  But lots of the parts are gone.  So I will be insearch of a second parts car to pickup the missing parts.  Inventory, preserve and start the search for a donor car. 53 Deluxe or Carolina if possible.  Here are a few more photos
http://circlekf.com/pnwkfoci/pnwcars/k-538-001166.html
« Last Edit: March 24, 2012, 02:51:34 PM by pnw_oldmags »
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HJ-ETEX

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Re: What makes a Carolina a Carolina?
« Reply #11 on: March 24, 2012, 08:20:00 PM »
Lowell: Chevy did some strange things with the SS package at times. There were 2 65 Impala SS locally with 6 cylinder engines, not even the base V8. And I am told Impala SS at that time could be had with a bench seat - no console. So you buy a car with a special trim package and then delete most of the special items!

When I first became involved with Kaisers, I was surprised because nearly 1/2 of the 51 Specials I ran across had Hydramatic trans. May be it was chance or may be a car with an automatic was not scrapped as quickly as a 3 spd or OD car (I doubt that though). May be it had something to do with factory allocations - after all a surprising percentage of Allstates and HJs were sold in Texas. I think really we tend to think of a 51 Special or later DeLuxes as "strippers" when they really aren't.  Most of what came on a Manhattan could be installed at the factory or by your smiling local dealer on your Special.
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1951 Kaiser Deluxe /327 Chevy
1951 Kaiser Deluxe (no funny stuff)
1968 Kaiser Commando V6
1961 Willys 2WD 134 F-Head SW
1963 Kaiser FC170

pnw_oldmags

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Re: What makes a Carolina a Carolina?
« Reply #12 on: March 24, 2012, 09:30:23 PM »
ADDING A FEW MORE
Trying to make a list of ways to identify a 1953 Carolina...
 1 - Data Plate Model would be 538-1 or 538-4
 2 - Serial Plate would start with K538
 3 - Front bumper would have no bananas or bumper guards
 4 - No Script on front fenders
 5 - Headlight rings should be stainless rings like a Henry J
 6 - Steering Wheel should be just a round center
 7 - Only a Driver Side Visor
 8 - Only a Driver Side B-Pillar Light
 9 - No K plaque on glove box
10 - Hard rubber Steering Wheel
11 - Inside Door Handles and window cranks are like Henry J
12 - Hub caps can be full dish Ks or small center K Caps
13 - Steering Column not enclosed on Manual Trany like Manhattans are.
14 - NO stainless down the sides.
Thoughts, changes, additions??
15.   Inside Mirror Base is painted not chromed
16.   No remote hood latch release
17.   No trunk light
18.   No rear ashtray / cigar lighter on the back of the front seat
19.   Rear door wing windows are fixed … they do not open
20.   Door Ventilator Division Bars were painted black not stainless

MOre to come I am sure.
 
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rialto

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Re: What makes a Carolina a Carolina?
« Reply #13 on: March 25, 2012, 12:51:55 PM »
  I think all Carolinas had beige lower dash,steering column,inst cluster and window moldings.The brown vinyl used was plain not dinosaur.The seat cloth was not corduroy like the DeLuxe but plainer. I didn't know about no inside hood latch. Carolinas had bumper guards like the DeLuxe with no bullets or bananas.

kaiserfrazerlibrary

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Re: What makes a Carolina a Carolina?
« Reply #14 on: March 25, 2012, 06:59:38 PM »
Please check out the info in the KFOCI HANDBOOK Version 4.0 on the car.  It will help fill some of the blanks