Kaiser Frazer Owners Club Forum
General Category => Cars For Sale & Wanted => Topic started by: jake on October 24, 2017, 01:49:46 AM
-
:-*
-
Its interesting they are all the same model and color combos. Wonder if they all had the same owner when new ? Image being a Kaiser dealer and selling three cars to one person.
-
That looks like Fred Walkers collection. A good buy if you need parts for your convertible.
-
The hardtop specific parts are worth the asking price by themselves.
-
1949 Kaiser Virginian parts car. Priced to sell @ $600. Don't ask if there are any fender skirts as they are long gone. What you see is all there is and it has lots of rust.The last picture shows two other Virginian's that are available for an additional charge. If you're reading the ad it's still for sale. 303-570-2812 mornings are best and keep calling as I'm hard to reach. Serious calls only. Bill of sale.
**
I kind of remember this seller a few years back. I spoke with him about his cars, and was close to purchasing a couple of non KF cars, a Triumph and a BMW. Can not remember where his ad was? Hemmings? But yes, he had 3-4 Virginians.
-
As one who regretfully gave up on a Polar Grey Virginian (in bad shape) I ask: where in the heck are you ever going to find the back window for a Virginian to replace the one missing in the photo? Unobtainium! And where are the bars?
I removed my glass and sold them to a KF guy in St. Louis at a modest price. Removal was tough and stressful.
Rudy got my hinges and some other parts.
-
Yes, I see that now. You google Peyton, you get some you tube videos and a link to an old AACA post.
That's the place. Interesting he has not sold any in years. I am not sure how I lost track of them.
-
As one who regretfully gave up on a Polar Grey Virginian (in bad shape) I ask: where in the heck are you ever going to find the back window for a Virginian to replace the one missing in the photo? Unobtainium! And where are the bars?
I removed my glass and sold them to a KF guy in St. Louis at a modest price. Removal was tough and stressful.
Rudy got my hinges and some other parts.
.
Ha! I'm the guy in St. Louis who bought the glass. I have always thought it would be a disaster to break a window in my Virginian so I sleep better having the spares....
-
Anyone going to buy one? I remember when I had mine there was a Virginian under restoration in Montana. Club member I believe.
I have often pondered - on rare unobtainium parts like that rear glass - with all the technology we have now, can we not remake the glass so 2 of these 3 cars "could" get restored if need be?
I have seen unobtainium parts - like latches to the woodies on the rear tailgates of cars - cause some cars to never get restored. Or in the case of the Buick 2 x 4 manifold/carb option on 64-66 Buicks, the asking prices are crazy.
If someone had the glass pieces out of these cars, to use as molds or "known good units" I would think it is in the best interest of all to have some of the 3 remade.
Even for those cars with glass that is good, the stress has to be huge. The glass is now - what? - 70 years old! Stay in the heat too long and hit a pot hole and there goes a crack! Of course it helps they are in back and very stable so maybe I am goofy.
But here you see 2 cars with rear glass issues that are probably preventing them from being purchased to restore.
If a run of 20 each could be done, that's 60 pieces, then should ensure that Virginian owners sleep better at night and some of these cars get restored.
-
Note on the one with intact glass, that the 'chrome' strip is heavily corroded (rust pits). That can not come out without removal of the glass. This would be a tough restoration.
I knew my glass was valuable and I had a nice garage. I remember taking the trim out of my interior with many of the screws not coming out (just spinning).
Once out, I decided to cut out the rubber surround with a utility knife with fresh blades. If I was lucky and could get under the glass, I could pull off fairly long chunks. I remember being very careful not to try and push the glass out for fear of breakage or having it go flying and crack on the floor.
I don't remember much about the strips. Mine were removed-restorable but needed the same love these need. Strip them, replate.
-
It is very expensive to have glass made and we are lucky to have windshields available for our 1951-'55 cars and Darrin's but the club can not afford to make very many at any one time. If enough owners needed several of any one piece they could possibly be made up if most were pre-sold so that we could get the investment back.
-
The bigger issue is getting the word out that the KFOCI exists and that we have a manufacturing fund. I'd like to say that everyone who owns a Kaiser, Frazer or Willys is member, or is at least aware of the club, but that's not the case. At least once a week I get an email or phone call from someone who came across either the club site or my personal site and was amazed that a organization exists for a car they own.
KF built some 750,000 cars. If 10% exist in some form (I know, I'm aiming high) then that's 7500 cars still on planet Earth. That amounts to quite a few potential members. Now, how to cost effectively reach them...
-
It is very expensive to have glass made and we are lucky to have windshields available for our 1951-'55 cars and Darrin's but the club can not afford to make very many at any one time. If enough owners needed several of any one piece they could possibly be made up if most were pre-sold so that we could get the investment back.
Gordie
Can you expound on the process? In other words, what is step 1, step 2, etc. I can not wrap my head around how to. If I had a windshield like your 51-55 cars, then there is probably a long lost mold somewhere? Mold? I don't know I am just guessing.
I guess I should google how glass is made.
-
I've been looking at the process for a piece I'd like to have.
Having glass bent can be done but is an expensive process. A mold is made, either from scratch or an existing "pattern" piece.
Glass is heated until it softens enough to conform to the mold. Tempered is similar but I haven't found anyone yet that does curved tempered auto glass in small runs.
-
Adam Harder is the manager of our Manufacturing Fund and he would be the man to talk to about the feasibility of making new items. He has sources for making glass and he could inquire about new items. The first thing to do would be to determine how many could be sold as if many are needed the cost could be spread over all buyers reducing the price for all. If not many people are interested the cost for making a few might be prohibitive. Several of us have had needed items made on our own in the past and that has worked out very well but glass is a specialty and there are few suppliers. Put an ad in the Bulletin and Forum to determine how much interest there would be for the item you are interested in having made. Also it would be necessary to provide a sample of the item which is necessary to figure dimensions and angles.
-
I've been looking at the process for a piece I'd like to have.
Having glass bent can be done but is an expensive process. A mold is made, either from scratch or an existing "pattern" piece.
Glass is heated until it softens enough to conform to the mold. Tempered is similar but I haven't found anyone yet that does curved tempered auto glass in small runs.
Thanks Mark.
-
Gordie:
Yep - the sample part is going to the hard part. The one Virginian in that group of 3 in the original ad has the 2 side pieces which as I recall are very "sturdy" owing to their smaller size. Someone would need to provide the longer piece in the middle.
As you note, a demand would need to be measured so you are correct, an ad needs to be placed in the newsletter. So, there were 935 or so hardtops made. (If I am off by a small measure, I am going by memory so be nice) I parted out one, there are 3 at this Colorado place and the one nice CC Virginian.
All in all, I suppose there are no more than 200 Virginians and Frazer hardtops left in any condition. 200 might be on the high side. This would be a tough justification especially with declining interest in restorations and the old car hobby, but we will see.
-
I don't know about declining interest in restoring old cars being a deterrent but the high cost of parts and labor today certainly puts a crimp in the restoration business. Unless you can do most of the work yourself it is very costly to restore a car today and the cost of a restoration would far exceed the value of most old cars.
-
It is very expensive to have glass made and we are lucky to have windshields available for our 1951-'55 cars and Darrin's but the club can not afford to make very many at any one time. If enough owners needed several of any one piece they could possibly be made up if most were pre-sold so that we could get the investment back.
Gordie
Can you expound on the process? In other words, what is step 1, step 2, etc. I can not wrap my head around how to. If I had a windshield like your 51-55 cars, then there is probably a long lost mold somewhere? Mold? I don't know I am just guessing.
I guess I should google how glass is made.
An American who lives in Bolivia has documented the restoration of a 1960 Corvair. His name is Richard Widman. He is an oil/lubrication expert who owns his own company there.
As part of the restoration, he had to remove the broken windshield in one piece, and then send it out to a glass manufacturer for a mold to be made. Here is a quote from him from the CorvairCenter Forum:
"I sent the broken one by bus to Santa Cruz, then took it to the glass shop where they made a mold, heated the glass, molded it, cured it, etc. Then I packaged it and put it back on the bus for the 450 mile ride through the mountains with my fingers crossed.
Charged double a normal one because of the complexity of the mold." http://corvaircenter.com/phorum/read.php?1,565897,565981#msg-565981
Here is the story of his restoration: http://www.widman.biz/Corvair/English/index.html
It seems to me that the capacity to reproduce exists, but it may be more cost efficient to look outside of the country...
Kevin
-
Thanks Kevin
Very interesting. How to make the mold? It would need to be moldable to the provided glass, so I would think plastic. But then plastic has to come in contact with molten glass?
The plus if there is one is that the Virginians back glass sections are smaller than a windshield. I would also think that modern glass technology would mean a more robust end result. If uncompromised original Virginian back glass has lasted 70 years, then brand new ones should last a lot longer.
-
Has anyone in the club purchased one or all of these Virginians? Seems a shame one of the iconic KF's sit there without any member interest.
-
the posting and deleting is getting to be just a wee bit frustrating.
-
the posting and deleting is getting to be just a wee bit frustrating.
For sure! :-\
That's what is good about the "quote" function - even if the specific post is deleted, the quote in your post will still be there.
-
the posting and deleting is getting to be just a wee bit frustrating.
For sure! :-\
That's what is good about the "quote" function - even if the specific post is deleted, the quote in your post will still be there.
I put the contact phone number in the 1st response I had for this post. I figured the cars would not sell.