Kaiser Frazer Owners Club Forum
General Category => General Discussion => Topic started by: darrin502 on February 21, 2014, 12:39:58 AM
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I think Rudy Phillips has had it with Kaisers, he told me if no one wants them he will crush them.
According to Rudy it only takes about 20 minutes to destroy a perfectly good Kaiser. I think he always had one wheel off the track but now he has completely gone off the rails. If you want some KF stuff call him fast or the metal man will get them. It seems he can get more for scrap then from KF people.
I THINK HE HAS GONE CRAZY.
He told me once he was going to dig a big hole with his backhoe and bury them all. I think his Kaiser parts days are going fast.
Here is a quote from Rudy:
This is how we restore them at Rudy's KF Parts. A solid rust free 49 Kaiser. Also a shot of Rudy's world car show. Just a small showing as I had a hard time picking best of show while enjoying a few cold beverages and the thrill of the smash.
Rudy
Check out the link of the pics he sent me. I think major therapy is in order.
http://www.hubgarage.com/mygarage/darrin502/vehicles/94826
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The cure is to attract and retain new members and interest them in fixing up a car. The KFOCI has a core group who have an illness of their own, they'll take on yet another project. I'm one of those with the sickness, witnessed by the two 47 Kaisers that magically appeared in my driveway over the last several months. But, those of us with the illness cannot continue to take on more work to save cars from the crusher. Rather, we need to spread the word that KF cars are inexpensive to buy, (for the most part), relatively easy to work on, and very different from the car show crowd of 57 Chevys, Mustangs, and Corvettes.
If you're involved at all in the hobby, then you've seen the articles written by some well-seasoned collectors noting the decline in membership in many clubs. For as long as I can remember, getting swap meet spaces at the AACA Hershey fall meet was next to impossible, but as of two years ago, one could walk up to any AACA tent and obtain as many as you want. People today have alot on their plate, and just as many distractions to take them away from owning an old car and participating in a club and its activities.
I don't have a magic answer to the issue of attracting new members, but I do have some ideas. We need to involve younger folks by using social media to our advantage. The club has a Facebook page at "Kaiser Frazer Owners Club International", but we need to spread its word and use it. At meets, let potential new members sit behind the wheel and experience the thrill we get every time we're in our car. We also need to develop programs that attract people to our club. A static car show in a hotel lot is great...if you're a member and you want to check out a fellow member's car...but it won't do much to grab the attention of non-members. How about a short driving tour thru town with predetermined stops at popular places? The local burger joint, a car dealership, or the local historical society are just a few that come to mind. Last summer, the CCCA had a driving tour that used our local historical village as an advertised stop and several hundred spectators showed up for the two hour layover.
So, don't fault Rudy for scrapping cars. His actions are just a by-product of the bigger issue...the declining interest in anything old by younger folks. If it doesn't say Apple or X-box on the label, they're just not interested. Our job is to let them know we're here and that owning and old car can be a rewarding experience.
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I can understand the KF parts is not a good business for several reasons. One, because there are not many Kaiser Frazer's being restored. I go to meets every year and there are very few newly restored cars showing up and we have several vendors plus Older KF members getting rid of their parts every year at low prices. Rare parts don't mean big prices. 57 Chevy's and Mustangs aren't rare and their parts get big prices.
I would like to see more young people in the club, but I am not sure that is the answer. Middle aged seem to be the better members. They seem to have more interest and money when they are 30, 40 or even 50.
I am not sure we can find a good solution.
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I'm confused. Did he crush the cars on the link? I recently bought a rear window gasket from him.
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Rudy says
Just brought two more from storage to crush, a rare 49 Kaiser Virginian and a 52 Kaiser. At least by crushing them they become more useful as new Toyota's or Honda's. In the last two years over 22,000 lbs of KF parts and cars have crossed the scales. Only another 100,000 lbs to go.
Maybe someone will offer u 10 cents a lb for the rest.lol
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supply and demand economics often do not apply to many of our vendors.
anything can be sold for the right price.
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Surly you can get more by reducing the price and selling cheap than you can at the crusher. I sell scrap medal from rail cars monthly and get better pricing than the general public does and the most I have ever sold prepared scrap medal was 15 cent a pound or there abouts.
I don't understand why you would scrap perfectly good cars. Even if you sold it for a thousand dollars it would be more than the scrap guy wou give you with a whole less effort.
I hate to hear of him destroying them but on the bright side he does not own every Kaiser. I own one he will not crush rare or not.
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Some of you in the Detroit MI area may remember a man named Barney Pollard. Barney had buildings full of pre World War II automobiles and trucks...so many of them that he stored them vertically (front end in the air)! Barney received numerous offers for some of his vehicles but didn't want to sell except at his price. He had hundreds of vehicles that went for scrap after his death as they sat too long without attention.
People get ideas as to what their Watchamacallit should be worth because they hear about a pristine example that may (or, it turns out may not) have sold at some fancy auction. If the alternative is to scrap (or perhaps, that's all the remains are good for) I agree that "fire sale" pricing is a viable alternative. You get more than the scrap man so you come out ahead on the deal ans some younger interested person gets a restorable vehicle at a price that allows him (or her) to restore it within their budget.
My observations over the last few years is that interest has waned because 1)People don't take their cars to non KFOCI events the way they should & 2)owners are not around their cars that much so people can talk to them.
You have to show the cars & talk to those who stop and look so the public knows they exist, what kind of realistic pricing goes with the cars and parts, AND that there is a club around to support the vehicles and have a more or less brain trust who can provide ideas and suggestions on parts sources, repair items, etc.
I took my cars to as many shows as possible during the times I had running vehicles. Even works in process were worthwhile to take when you showcase it with the story of the restoration work done so far and what is planned for the near future...a kind of watch this space thing to see how the project evolves over time to show it can be done.
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If I have mine back by mid March I'll have it in a local show. If not, it will be in the next one. We have a group of folks with old cars, Fords, Pontiacs, Buicks and so forth. They do a ride each month. Plan in getting in that group when my car is back from being painted. I rent a garage uptown and plan on putting out a KF sign on the building.
Everyone in town knows what a KF is but most haven't seen one in a mighty long time. I got mine because I wanted one (my grandfather sold them) and because I could find one affordable. Once I joined the club I found out how resourceful the club is.
I've been to one KF function back in the early 2000's in Mobile Alabama and did not even own nor had never seen a KF. They treated me like I was one of them and although it took me 13 years I finally got one. Look forward to getting a Frazer to go with it.
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Coming from a new Kaiser owner and collector. If you/we want to keep kaisers out in the public eye ergo keep or expand the public recognition of these cool old cars we need to show, inform, help, email, call back, give some good deals, display all the cool Kaiser products. Again i have only been of the fringe of the Kaiser hobby for a few years and have found some real nice people especially on this forum. I attended the national convention this summer and saw some great cars but of course you're all Kaiser people (and fairly old on average ;).
I go to a massive car show in St. Paul every year and last year not a single Kaiser (other than Darrins which i really don't count).
I also have tried to buy parts, products, information and such with about members. ONLY 1 has let go of anything and about half never call back or email. So new collector all excited and willing to spend $ cant seem to get his buying fix.
I have been a part of three major hobbies in my life and so far Kaiser collectors seem to want to hang on to their stuff more than any other hobby i have been a part of.
So in my opinion we all need to show, share, give, help anyone who may get a passion for these old cars.
By the way I am restoring a Dragon for the first time in my life and it is not going well :-[
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Why don't you consider a Darrin a Kaiser?
I have 3 and I consider them Kaisers. And I show them all the time. I am proud of my cars and like all KF cars good bad or ugly.
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Oh i like them bet really more of a concept car. I consider Kasiers to big American metal cars. Nothing against smaller plastic (I have a 59 vette). ;D
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A guy at the last car show asked me about a part for his car so I gave him the latest bulletin that I always bring with me.
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Yes, the big steel sedans were the bread and butter, but Darrins are Kaisers too, after all. I like them all--just sold a Dragon.
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This story sounds familiar. Without going into the details of a protracted purchase for some of Rudy's NOS Aero parts a few years ago, he told me at one point that he was of a mind to just bury the lot and be done with them. I replied that he should do just that, and then everything I had would be worth more............ although I was shocked at the thought of NOS parts being landfilled.
He recently traded the collection to Duane Hayes.
Not saying Rudy isn't crushing metal, maybe just what he knows isn't likely to have a demand. I have more Aero parts than I'll need. When my car is assembled I'll keep some spares, sell what will sell, post the rest for free and scrap what no one wants rather than store them for the rest of my life.
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I know storing and trying to dispose of extra/ leftover parts is a pain. Years after I finished my 57 chevy wagon I sold parts for 10c on the dollar just to have someone use them. I gave stuff away, just sent some to a felow in CA. When it looked like I would have to keep storing doors etc I loaded up an 84 car and my truck with stuff and took it all to the scrapyard.
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I called Rudy yesterday to order gaskets for the doors on my Kaiser. He was very friendly and we spoke on the subject of Kaisers for about an hour. No mention of crushing Kaisers came up and he seemed to know a lot about them. Having talked to him on the phone and reading these posts seems to be a disconnect somewhere.
At any rate he had the gaskets for $100 (included all four doors) and if they were as good as the rear window gasket I got from him I'll be well pleased.
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I've been to Rudy's place in Ramona and he doesn't have alot of space to store cars...especially those needing serious resurrection. So, the fact that he's forced to occasionally recycle one or two cars doesn't surprise me. He recently constructed a large addition to his shop that's allowed him to store more parts, which is a good thing for all of us looking for that rare odd or end!
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He has 1 or 2 cargo containers as well at his Dad's place in the same area, so he has more then shows. He is just someone that you need to be patient with in trying to contact.
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I was blessed to have Rudy stop by my home last summer on his way to the National meet and pick up some previously purchased Virginian parts. He is a great hobbyist and I enjoyed our visit.
Last month there was a big to do about a long time salvage yard in Montana crushing rare Mopar parts. A lot of hobbyists felt this was horrific. I suspect Rudy might crush some grocery getter slab siders, but I doubt he would crush Virginians.
But the point is, this is America and we pride ourselves on our personal property rights and privileges. My tune has changed over the years from "must save every car" to realizing that 1. there is still a surplus of old cars and 2. it's an individuals decision to crush or not.
I had to give away parts or send them to the dump (a nice radiator core for example) lots of trim was thrown away. I sent some parts to some folks and lost money on postage because the parts are heavy.
I tried to give away free literature or lost a lot of money on the literature. I personally think many in the KF crowd are cheapskates and that sounds harsh but it's not. It's OK. Better then being into Mopar musclecars where you can't restore a Challenger or Cuda for less then $50,000 and the entry fee is $7000 for a pile of junk.
Rudy offered me a nice rust free 49 Manhattan when he visited for $1000. I turned him down because I was head deep into a different make then (Mercedes) but now of course I am clearing out again. But a 49 Frazer Manhattan, solid non running project for $1000 is very fair money and the cost to restore a 49 Frazer or Kaiser has to be less in some respects then a 49 Cadillac, Buick, Chrysler etc. due to the simpler architecture behind the car. (i.e. Continental 6 vs V8's or such)
I posted and maybe Jake about those 49-50 Virginians in Colorado for sale for like $700 to $1500 or so. Ridiculous low pricing for what they represent.
As a member of many other clubs, the mantra that "clubs need to attract new younger members" is getting old. I agree with Jack that if I had a running driving KF, I would regularly attend multi make car shows. That would help.
Consider also, that one of the reasons people do not restore a particular car is access to rare parts, fabrics, kits. I think KFOCI does a good job of being close knit in this regard and advising where to get parts and keeping SMS on the ball for fabrics. It's a great club, even if many don't appreciate my market comments, I think there are a lot of great people in the club.
Rudy's dilemma being a parts guy is demand. It's not there. isn't part of it the homogenous nature of KF? By that I mean KF did not necessarily have planned obsolescence. The same motor more or less was made for years, same on the transmissions, etc.
How many of common parts do you need?
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I have known Bob Drake who makes Early Ford V8 parts for many years and he told me that if it weren't for the street rodders he would be out of business. Well, there aren't many Kaisers or Frazers being made into street rods and probably not a lot of them being restored either. We are really lucky to have access to the parts that Rudy and others maintain for us.
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I spoke with Rudy again yesterday (he called me) and again enjoyed the conversation. I've ordered som door gaskets and he had a trim piece I needed. He seems a knowledgable guy who is easy to do business with. Is like to meet him one day.
I've built mid 60 Fords and they can be challenging to get parts for unless you are building a Mustang. I would say it is just about as hard to find a gas tank for a 63 Thunderbird as it is to find one for a Kaiser.
I had a family connection to KF so that is where my interest began. I met some folks in Mobile Alabama and they were real nice folks. One gave me a ride in a restored Traveler with over drive.
I wouldn't swap my 49 Kaiser for a Cadillac even though I'd like to have a Cadillac. The cars are easy to work on, relatively inexpensive to work on and you get a lot of attention when driving one. The club and this forum add to that. Lots of folks with advice. I plan on a Frazer when I get done with the current project.
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I spoke with Rudy again yesterday (he called me) and again enjoyed the conversation. I've ordered som door gaskets and he had a trim piece I needed. He seems a knowledgable guy who is easy to do business with. Is like to meet him one day.
I've built mid 60 Fords and they can be challenging to get parts for unless you are building a Mustang. I would say it is just about as hard to find a gas tank for a 63 Thunderbird as it is to find one for a Kaiser.
I had a family connection to KF so that is where my interest began. I met some folks in Mobile Alabama and they were real nice folks. One gave me a ride in a restored Traveler with over drive.
I wouldn't swap my 49 Kaiser for a Cadillac even though I'd like to have a Cadillac. The cars are easy to work on, relatively inexpensive to work on and you get a lot of attention when driving one. The club and this forum add to that. Lots of folks with advice. I plan on a Frazer when I get done with the current project.
A fantastic post. Your comments point out the best aspects of the club and is proof that if you give someone a ride in your old car, then they usually become hooked. You point out that the cars are easy to work on, inexpensive to buy and own, you hit all the reasons.
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I sure cannot fault Rudy, I have scrapped 9 restorable kaisers, I had brought them to my farm, advertized them for the cost of the gas it took to get them here. Most of the calls i got were from the midwest,and wanting me to help with the cost of them driving to California to get them, or asking for pictures, which were sent and the response was it would cost too much to come afere them. Right now i have a 54 Man, 53 Black over white Dragon and a 53 parts car. The floor in the Dragon HAS NO RUST , needs left 1/4 work and roof at area behind rear doors had power steering, I advertized it for $500.00 got ZIP response.
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Over the past 3 decades I have scrapped out I think 8 Aeros. Most were beyond saving due to crashes or rust but yielded some good parts, making the parts worth more than the whole. At least 3 of them were excellent shells, missing only engines and transmissions. One even had a reupholstered seats. Nobody wanted them and the parts were more valuable, so They got stripped out and junked. I am sorry they are gone, but not everything is worth restoring.
We all know that our favorite cars, for the most part, are not worth much or are even desirable to most of the old car world (yes, Darrins, convertibles are the exceptions). Save the good ones and the rare ones if possible, but let's stay realistic.
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hey guys where is rudy located,,,and would he sell the kaiser for scrap price to a person.
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Rudy is located in Ramona, CA which is about a half hour east of San Diego. He probably has several cars for sale at any given time.
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Kaiser Bill in Utah and the Fred Walker estate in Colorado have about 100 cars each stored on their property and I know that Kaiser Bill has some cars that he would sell for $100 as I bought one of them and never bothered to pick it up. I'm sure that it must have cost at least that much just to get it towed to his property when he purchased it. There are plenty of inexpensive cars available but prepare to bring them home yourself on a car trailer. That is part of the adventure. I found my GP Frazer in Florida, the '51 convertible in Iowa, my Airflow at Hershey, the '53 Manhattan in Fresno CA, the Allstate in Santa Barbara and I trailered them all home. The trailer cost $1,000 new and it has certainly paid for itself many times over. Rudy found a couple of early Frazer's for me several years ago and wouldn't take any finders fee at all. That is what kind of guy he is!
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It is about a days drive from Nebraska but you had better wait for spring to go now!
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Hey! I got a new toy just like it! Not only that, we apparently live in identical houses!
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its wild that these cars sell so cheap i live in west virginia so theres not many around here.someone should tell the guys from road kill that could be a cheap episode,,,pick one up make it run and drive it home.
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I need an air cleaner for my dads Darrin , kd161001318 . Any help would be awsome. Gill Chandler.1.574 256.7182.
Or.... gillcam1190 @ gmail.com . Chris @ willow run referred me to you. It is the basic 161 engine.
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Surly you can get more by reducing the price and selling cheap than you can at the crusher. I sell scrap medal from rail cars monthly and get better pricing than the general public does and the most I have ever sold prepared scrap medal was 15 cent a pound or there abouts.
I don't understand why you would scrap perfectly good cars. Even if you sold it for a thousand dollars it would be more than the scrap guy wou give you with a whole less effort.
I hate to hear of him destroying them but on the bright side he does not own every Kaiser. I own one he will not crush rare or not.
In the economic climate of supply and demand, there is just too much supply and there has been a sea change in interests that is generational.
I was an auto mechanic from 1998 to 2005. Cars are complicated today so fewer "modern" cars will be collected and those that are will be more bulletproof or they will get crushed. That's the "gap" in the generations.
There are just too many parts and they are heavy and take up room. I met Rudy and I would say he is my age (50-55). I know I have to start thinking about limitations re: time, money, resources.
If I buy just ONE KF to restore or own - then I have to dod it with a clear head. That is, the money, time must mean I enjoy that time and expenditure for the eventual car to enjoy 5 years from now. I would be 57 years old.
Now take that example and apply it to the possible "youth" generation, approximately age 25 to 42 or so. You need a garage, tools, evening time and money. OR try different less expensive hobbies, like fishing, biking, owning a motorcycle, gardening etc.
Rudy has done so much good for the hobby, he is not alone in crushing. A well known yard in Montana called Freemans decided to crush his entire inventory in 2014 because it was time to retire. This created a lot of hand wringing amongst hobbyists that "rare" cars and parts were going away.
I suggested an opposite opinion. The cars had been in the yard for years and years, parted to the "market's extent". If demand had essentially ceased, then the remains needed to be crushed and repurposed, at the owners discretion not well intended hobbyists.
That opinion wasn't well received.
During KF's 1st 4 years they made 'millions' of cars, many essentially identical. Unlike creating models that are more rare, such as convertibles or specialty sports cars as KF did from 1949 on, the making of "sameness" meant plenty of parts in the future. Therefore, crushing a slab sider should not be seen as blasphemy.
The club's membership is declining, which is a microcosm of the market for parts and cars. If the membership has declined by, say 20% in the last 6 years, then parts demand has decreased by 20% as well.
Now consider that Rudy and other KF parts guys have built their inventories back when the glory days were in place, and you can see the economic principles of supply and demand at work.
So no big deal to crush some slab siders or plentiful 50's KF's.
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Sad, but true. I was at a car show yesterday and it seems the vast majority of interest is now
on the "muscle" cars of the sixty's. I would say the owners are in their 50"s. Everybody knows
what a Pontiac GTO is, but they are not familiar with our KF products. Generating interest in
our wonderful cars is getting more difficult. I have four adult sons and none are interested in
my '51 Kaiser. Mustang yes, Kaiser no. Sad
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Generally speaking, one tends to collect what you drove as a teenager. For me, most of the heaps I piloted around the streets were built in the late 60s and early 70s. Some of my best buys were cars such as a Hemi Roadrunner...purchased for all of $895 from the local Chevy dealer in 1976 and a 1973 Mazda RX2 that would consistently outrun the Roadrunner in the quarter mile.
My father had two Kaisers during those years, both bought because he never had two nickels to rub together and Kaisers were cheap cars in the early to mid 60s. His fondness for the cars - because they were different - rubbed off on me so that's why I now have four KFs in my stable. But, I still like the stuff I drove while in high school and while I realize another cheap Roadrunner isn't in my future, if something closer to the 1977 Pontiac Grand LeMans I once owned crossed my path, I might just be tempted...
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It is interesting to find out why KFOCI members and forum folks are interested in ownership of KF's. Your story was interesting.
My dad had Fords and Chevy's and had no inclination toward cars as a hobby. I grew up a car nut for whatever reason and my downfall is that I am a generalist interested in so many different makes and time periods. It's a sickness.
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My dad believed in the independent car companies to avoid a monopoly. There really wasn't any
foreign cars to speak of in the early fifties. My uncle drove Hudsons and my dad drove Frazers
and then Kaisers from 1950 to 1971 and drove Ramblers after that. The Big Three as GM, Ford
and Chrysler were called really did own the market. Used independent cars went for little or
nothing when you tried ti trade them in on a Big Three model. Maybe that was how they could
could destroy the independents. Big three price wars did more damage to the independents as
they had higher costs and could not compete. My first car was a running "51 Kaiser Deluxe with
OD and everything worked. I paid $60 and all it needed was a muffler and a tailpipe.
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If only we knew then what we know now. I graduated in 1982 and remember combing the used car lots for cars from my youth in the 70's that I wanted to collect, and at bargain prices.
Imagine it's 1963 and you spot old KF's in the back row of used car lots, like 53 Dragons, maybe a Virginian or nice old Travelers or Vagabonds. 54 Manhattans with 50,000 miles on them for $200 or so. wimper.
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I bought a running 54 Kaiser Darrin with a spare NOS tinted windshield for $1100 and due to
storage problems sold it and a 51 Frazer 4 door hardtop a few years later. Ouch. Hindsight is
indeed 20/20. Oh, and my Allstate was sold at that time too. My friend found a '55 Willys
Bermuda two door hardtop in a junk yard (they weren't called salvage yards then) missing the
engine, trans and a tail light. Other than that it was perfect. We put it back together, but then
he needed money to put down on a three acre lot to build a house on and sold it. This was in
the early 70's and yards were crushing 50's cars. We paid $35 for the Burmuda and could have
had a pick of other KFW products. I regret that because he wanted to sell me the Willys and I
had no room.
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I bought a running 54 Kaiser Darrin with a spare NOS tinted windshield for $1100 and due to
storage problems sold it and a 51 Frazer 4 door hardtop a few years later. Ouch. Hindsight is
indeed 20/20. Oh, and my Allstate was sold at that time too. My friend found a '55 Willys
Bermuda two door hardtop in a junk yard (they weren't called salvage yards then) missing the
engine, trans and a tail light. Other than that it was perfect. We put it back together, but then
he needed money to put down on a three acre lot to build a house on and sold it. This was in
the early 70's and yards were crushing 50's cars. We paid $35 for the Burmuda and could have
had a pick of other KFW products. I regret that because he wanted to sell me the Willys and I
had no room.
oh you're killin' me! We all have those stories. It would have been great to be a part of that generation that could get cars cheaply, maybe buy 5-10 and pick off one every 2 years to restore. Keep them maintained and enjoy.
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I got started with the K/F line in the late 40's.... My Uncle was a dealer - so for me - a lot of my knowledge of the cars was first hand.
And even though I've bought other collector cars - the K/F brand has always remained my primary old car interest. Here's a picture of the dealership around 1962. If you look closely you'll see an unsold new car still sitting in the showroom. I think this happened to a lot of
the rural dealers..... When Kaiser quit in 1955 people shied away from our favorite cars much like they did the Edsel's in the early 60's.
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I got started with the K/F line in the late 40's.... My Uncle was a dealer - so for me - a lot of my knowledge of the cars was first hand.
And even though I've bought other collector cars - the K/F brand has always remained my primary old car interest. Here's a picture of the dealership around 1962. If you look closely you'll see an unsold new car still sitting in the showroom. I think this happened to a lot of
the rural dealers..... When Kaiser quit in 1955 people shied away from our favorite cars much like they did the Edsel's in the early 60's.
Hollenway
I think you probably have a lot to share. Hopefully if you have a story or two it can get in a Quarterly.
So that would be a 1954 Kaiser in the showroom or a different make? Are you saying that the new Kaiser sat in the showroom for 6 years?
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Actually the car in the showroom was a 1951 plain jane two door sedan. The car was used as a demo for
a while by my Uncle's nephew and never was titled. They ran it on MV plates for it's entire life to my knowledge. Over the years it was rode hard and put away wet !!! In 1954 Kaiser decided to give the dealers
a real break on pricing and when the opportunity presented itself Uncle Clair bought six new Manhattans.
But the cars didn't sell well and four of them ended up as cars they used in his coal stripping business. In fact several of them they removed the seats from and installed a cut down school bus seat for the driver and used them for mechanics and grease buggies in the strip mine. At least that way my Uncle got a write-off and
some use out of the money he had invested in them. I know it sounds harsh today - but at that time a
lot of the dealers were pretty disgusted with Kaiser - and I'm sure there are many more stories just like this one.
In the 70's they removed a large fuel tank behind the garage ( pre EPA rules..... ) and to backfill the hole
they pushed a 1949 Onyx over Lambswool Frazer Manhattan into the hole. I remember when they did
this - Uncle Clair had passed away by that time and his son was in charge of the family business. Sad end to a really nice old car !!!!
The last car from the dealership that wasn't literally destroyed was the Signal Green over Jade Tint 54 Manhattan that I now have. It took me 30 years to track the car down and buy it back....... but it's in the garage safe and sound and will be until they put me in the same place as that poor 49 Frazer !!!!!
I have many recollections of going out to Pittsburgh Kaiser Frazer on Penn Avenue to pick up the new cars
as well as many stories about the issues with the cars themselves. We had some loyal customers who still bought the cars even though they knew the end was near. When the final hammer fell though.... you seriously couldn't give the cars away.
Still - it was a wonderful experience - and I'm glad I got to live through those times - as well as having a wonderful mentor and friend in my Uncle. He was the one who got the gasoline and oil flowing through my veins and my life is much richer because of the years we spent together.
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Reading this thread with a bit of ennui. I purchased a 54 Manhattan last winter for the sheer uniqueness of it. And in driving it around it has garnered quite a bit of attention, comment and thumbs up. One of the younger engineers in my firm thought it the coolest thing he had ever seen, and he has seen my Alfa's and E type Jag. It is just that unique in appearance, period! It is not a show stopper but clean and decent from 20'. And I now have everything functioning (rebuilt horn ring and finished installation of electric fuel pump today) with exception of the period aftermarket A/C. A sagging market is a mixed bag. I may have overpaid for mine but I bought it to enjoy not as a speculative investment. Read just last night of a 1939 Alfa 6C 2500 sport bought for $300 in 1970 and it sold at auction for 2.1M. I bought a Model t in 1968 for $400 hard grass cutting money. The Alfa was the better speculation. But my T was not owned by Mussolini and I did not spend $750k on the restoration. In fact just finished restoring that T last year after 46 years apart, and my grandkids love riding in it. And the custom or resto-mod craze has its benefits too. Popularity and the Internet made restoration of my 1933 Plymouth a lot easier a few years back. It was my Greatgranddads car new.
Brings be to a question on my Kaiser's history. In looking at the Hub garage pictures of Darin 502, I think I see my car at Rudy's, just depends on time of picture. The first picture is at Rudy's, the other of my car now in TN. I note the green painted wire wheels with Mopar hubcaps, the yellow KF Foglights, and most telling (I believe) the same yellow (1979 Missouri) inspection sticker in the lower left of the windshield. The owner from whom I purchased the car had replaced the dry rotted tires with the current thin whites. I have some Coker's to go on it soon. Anybody out there able to weigh in on this speculation? Enjoyed my Labor Day playing w/ the Kaiser.
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Sure looks like the same car to me. Both pictures show a car with a tinted/shaded windshield, something not common on the 54s.
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In 1956 I bought a good running 1947 Kaiser for $25.00 for a transportation car. They weren't worth much then but it ran so well that years later I wanted another one and I have enjoyed them ever since. As a used car dealer for over fifty years I bought and sold over 10,000 cars. I had some great ones and kept a few but I wished I had had the money and space to keep more of them.
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Jake, tell me about the blue on blue in the right side of the Car Show photo.
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Not sure where this thread has gone.
bringing it back to the present.
Rudy is at it again, ever vigilant, with my hidden camera I have captured more crushed Kaisers.
I have heard through the grapevine that Rudy wants to get out of the Kaiser parts business and would like to sell everything he has. So step right up and be that person, call Rudy Phillips and make him an offer to save his stuff from the crusher or keep him in business by buying some Kaiser parts. He says the Kaiser parts sales are almost non existent and the space it takes up can be better used.
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This is tragic. Such cool cars deserve a better fate. Any possibility he would put together a list of cars he wants to get rid of so we could buy/save them?
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Rudy has just a few parts cars left and better ones in his garages. If you want to see a collection of over 100 each check out Kaiser Bill Browns's back yard or the cars from Fred Walkers estate. Most will never find a home.
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Kaisers aren't the only orphans feeling "unwanted". This same story is being told by the Hudson and Nash guys (and I'm sure others) as well. It seems that quite a few cars, long tucked away in barns for that "someday" are now being dragged out in the hopes that someone will want them. This has created somewhat of a surplus of cars- restorable or not - on the market. Unfortunately, the cost of transporting anything even a moderate distance, coupled with high postage costs for parts, has made it difficult for most back yard hobbyists to step up the plate and get into a restoration.
What Rudy is doing is just emblematic of the issues facing the old car industry.
If you're interested in getting into the hobby and have the ability to save a car or two, contact him. I visited with him a few years ago and he had several cars on his property he was willing to give away, just to get them into the hands of someone who would save them. I'm sure his inventory has changed, but I recall a much better than average 54 two door, several early cars, as well as other 51-53 Kaisers that were mine for the taking.
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How does one reach him and where does he live?
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Here is a link to Rudy's Parts List.
Phone number and address on cover.
http://circlekf.com/vendor/RudyCatalog2017.pdf
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Thank you. Sorta makes it tough on delivery expenses for him and customers with him in California.
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Delivery cost is the main reason I never purchased a rare leather interior code 1948 Frazer from Rudy. I wonder if he still has it or has parted it out. I would email him but I just sound like a wanna be pest. I stay interested until I see the cost to transport to Iowa, which is more than his asking price.
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A U-haul truck and trailer can be rented and that reduces your cost to the price of fuel, food and motels. I moved 28 vehicles across the country and back that way but I bought my own truck and trailer.
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If it is boxed up well, ship it by Greyhound bus, incredibly inexpensive!!! You just have to get to a Greyhound station as does Rudy.
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Greyhound is great for large bulky parts but it needs to be packaged well.
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THAT, Sir, is the kind of attitude that frustrates the crap out of those of us who are looking for parts, and getting NO response. If they are For Sale...LET US KNOW...and How Much. Hoarding helps NO ONE.
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Part of the attraction for this hobby should be that it is inexpensive. Too many things are done just to make money. The enjoyment we get from working on our vehicles - rehabing, restoring, customizing, maintaining, showing or however we like to interact with them - should be the goal. While it might be nice to turn a profit flipping cars or holding onto a classic and watching it appreciate in value, the folks that are counting on that are likely to be disappointed. Our old cars are beautiful, useful and most of all FUN.
If you want an automotive investment get a Ferrari or a Packard (and cross your fingers). If you want a fun time with a car you can use every day, get a Kaiser or a Plymouth or a Hudson... so many good choices!
Losing great cars to the crusher hurts all of us. Better to give a car away to an enthusiastic kid than to lose it forever. Even better - help them fix it up the way they want it.
That said, also support the people that have taken the time to start a business supporting your favorite brand. Without them to supply the pieces and often the expertise, we could have a difficult time.
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Rudy has just a few parts cars left and better ones in his garages. If you want to see a collection of over 100 each check out Kaiser Bill Browns's back yard or the cars from Fred Walkers estate. Most will never find a home.
Swapped emails with Duane Hayes a few days ago. He said he recently bought the Walker collection of Kaisers (100+) to keep the estate from crushing them, hopefully to be bought or at least parted out. If anyone concerned with saving cars wants to adopt a few orphans, I'm sure Duane would welcome that.
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Good to hear. How do we get in touch with Duane?
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That is great news! Hopefully Duane will be able to make up a list of what is available and their conditions. Duane is a KFOCI member and lives in Colorado.
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I'm guessing it was neither cheap or easy to take on a hundred cars. I'm sure Duane would welcome some interest.
donegoing2002@yahoo.com (http://donegoing2002@yahoo.com)
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Can't reach him with that link...???
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The point of the picture is?
If Duane wants to do something with the cars, there should be a new thread for it, rather than use THIS VERY OLD NEWS (check the dates on the first posts) to talk about it.
Many club members don't have barns or lots of land to keep cars on, and they just get worse over time. Rudy offered the cars for sale back years ago, and the restorable stuff got new homes. He got rid of what remained as it was not good for parts or to be restored. Don't forect that California and the west coast has its own deterioration problems with salt in the air off the Pacific Ocean. Since most of the forum users are not members, they would not know about Andy Schroyer (may have last name mispelled) who had dozens of K-F cars stored out in an orange grove. When the land was redeveloped, a lot of cars were found with body rot, including holes in the roof from the accumulation of the salt.
I agree with comments from other posters on other threads about cleaning out the old stuff from the Forum. But club management first has to establish criteria (last post date, topic being out dated, etc) before the cleaning can take place.
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Cleaning isn't a problem for me. Interesting to read how current comments happened.
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I agree if you remove information from the past you loose some answers from people who may have the information you are looking for.
I have found many answers from the past.
Lee