Kaiser Frazer Owners Club Forum
General Category => Kaiser Forum => Topic started by: JoeKeys2010 on September 06, 2014, 09:48:32 PM
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Well I caved in and converted to 12 volts. Much better starting and reliability. I wanted to keep the 6 volt system but got tired of the battery going flat all the tom. So far I'm happy with the 12 volt system.
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So how do you find a 12v starter for a Kaiser?
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I did not change the starter. 12 volts will not hurt it but does mak it spinn much faster.
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True,
The 12 volt will not hurt the starter if you don't run the starter long enough for it to get over heated.
I personally don't know how long that would be, but a well tuned engine should start long before it gets hot enough to do permanent damage.
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I have the 6 Volt Optima Gel Battery. With 980 Cold Cranking Amps, My 6 volt starts like a 12 volt.
Did you go with 12 volt alteranator or generator?
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In the 70's we would throw in an 8 volt battery, which didn't require a lot of changes. Are they still around?
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I went with the 1 wire GM Alternator because it was most available. I used the bracket that bolts to the side of the block. I had to modify i because it did not line up. I took it off, heat and beat it so that it only had one 90 degree bend. I drilled two additional holes in it so that it moved the bracket toward the radiator. Then it and the top bracket lined up and all the pulleys lined up and the deed was done.
Changed coils and reversed the wires. Disconnected the voltage regulator since the alternator has a built in one.
Took more time to modify the bracket than to do the conversion. Car cranks right up.
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Yes 51 deluxe 8 volt batteries are still around I currently have two one in a 51 and one for my55 I also have two 8 volt battery tenders while not poplar on this forum I find them to be well suited for my needs cars start well bulbs have not burned out I did have a voltage dropping resistor installed for my radios
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I did everything, rebuilt generator, bought new regulator, made sure connections were good, tested battery, took it to a shop, bought a jump box and still had poor performance with 6 volts. I'd like to drive my car around without worrying if I flood it or pad it too much the battery will die.
Very pleased with the 12 volts.
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The one wire alternators are popular because of the ease of installation. The regular 3 wire ones are only slightly more work and if you are away from home readily available anywhere. I give the optima battery very high marks. It does not run down during long periods f inactivity.
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If you install an 8 volt batt the charging system wont keep it charged as it is set for 6 volts. If you crank the reg. up to 8 volt settings the gen wont last too long. This is based on something that is used daily.
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I have the 6 Volt Optima Gel Battery. With 980 Cold Cranking Amps, My 6 volt starts like a 12 volt.
This sounds like the best solution for me- good, dependable starting and no other changes needed to the charging system.
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I had nothing but problems with my 6 v and did everything I knew to do. Not much trouble changing it over and it starts like a dream. No more popping the hood every time I stop.
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I am hard pressed to understand why some are having problems with 6V systems.
I have 2: 54 restored Darrin and an unrestored 51 HJ.
Admittedly I do not drive them at 10 below, but the surely start every time at 32 degrees.
I put Battery Tenders on each if they are going to sit for an extended period.
What am I doing that others are not or am I just lucky?
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I guess lucky. Admittedly I have not enough experience to make mine crank within a revolution or two and I probably have not projected the manual choke and the patting of the gas pedal. There just is no forgiveness and I hate popping the hood every time the battery goes flat. With a 12 volt it cranks right up, no tenders, no popping the hood no feelings of I hope it starts.
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Terry, my cars are all original 6 volt systems and they start just fine. Having the correct gauge battery cables can make the difference between them turning over properly. Battery cables corrode and get damaged over many years and a lot of cars had the cables replaced with 2 gauge types used on 12 volt systems. The 6 volt cars need 1 or 0 gauge cables. Using the 2 gauge makes a big difference. We had one Henry J which was converted to 12 volts and we left the 6 volt starter in it. That one we did drive in below zero weather and yes, 12 volts really helped! Never burned up a starter in it but I do remember it would spit that cigar lighter right out when you tried to use it!
(http://im1.shutterfly.com/media/47a4d729b3127ccef744af92cca900000030O01SatmLdmyB7efAA/cC/f%3D0/ls%3D00203070160520140909025821458.JPG/ps%3D50/r%3D0/rx%3D550/ry%3D400/)
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Now that makes sense.
I guess paying attention to instructions/detail really helps.
Not luck after all.
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Terry if you read my previous post you will see that the car has had the generator rebuilt, voltage regular replaced, been to a shop, put on a trickle charger, battery tested and connections cleaned and still the car has no capacity to crank of any length of time and is unreliable. If there is instructions or detail I have not paid attention to I don't know what it could possibly be.
I am very happy with the results, the car turns over, no trickle charger, jump boxes or worrying if the car will crank without raising the hood every time I want to start it. I suspect there was a reason the automobile industry went to a 12 volt system almost 60 years ago....its more reliable.
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How old was your 6v battery?
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I don't know. All I know is it tested good from three different sources.
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With my daily drivers, I routinely change batteries around 4-5 years old as they always get undependable. I'm sure they would still test good and will still start the car, but leave the headlights on for ten minutes and they won't. Since I'm about to drive my '51 to the Jackson meet, I'm a bit concerned about my battery, as I don't know how old it is. It cranks on the slow side. But last time the car was hot and hard to start, it did keep cranking for a couple of minutes- so I can't really condemn it yet.
Can't blame you for going to 12v as it gives you some peace of mind. I do think, though, that a recent 6v battery with the right cables and a good starter is usually up to the task. Cars got along with them for over 50 years.
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My mother is old enough to remember 6 volt cars. She said she always tried to park on an incline just in case.
It sure turns over easy and fires right up no matter what I do to the choke or gas pedal. I fought the 6v too long. I suppose if it works for you and you don't mind plugging your car in every time it is going to sit for a day or two that's ok too.
I want to drive mine all over and I want to know when I hit the starter button it's going to crank. I'm planning on coming to Jackson and was going to pull the car up but am having a problem with the brakes. If I find the time and the problem this weekend I'll bring it if not maybe next time.
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I think the primary reason for switching to 12-volt was higher compression. Our cars don't need 12 volts if everything else is working properly, including the 1 gauge cables--very important. I've always used 6-volts in my Kaisers and have never had a problem with them out of the ordinary. Now, using a generator, is a different story: your headlights dim every time your engine goes down to idle, but if you can live with that, they work fine.
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I was away from the car for a week. No trickle charger, no plugging in anything. Came home and she cranked up like it was a Ford. I can live with that.
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By the way, Fid, I like the snow covered Henry J.
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hey joe can you take pics of your alternator set up and what did you do about your guages and heater motor,,,,,,,,
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I'm away from home at the moment but will take some pictures later this week when I return home. I can tell you I have been completely satisfied with the conversion and no long wonder if the car is going to start.
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ok thanks man ,,,did you put ballast resisters on everything or just to main power wire to the guages
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I recently bought a 1953 Kaiser Deluxe sedan. I am thinking of moving the electrics to 12 volts and am reading the various threads on here with interest.
One thing that springs to mind - what size of 12 volt battery did you use? The dimensions of the 6 volt battery are 220mm x 170mm wide x 180mm tall.
Looking around, most larger-capacity 12 volt batteries are physically quite a lot bigger than those dimensions and wouldn't fit in to the battery tray.
Any suggestions on battery "type", capacity needed etc very gratefully received.
Giles (new Kaiser owner in London, England)
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Well, after a few weeks experience I can tell you that 12v conversion is unnecessary, at least for me. This battery alone, the Optima 6v, with the right cables and connections will do the job. No, it won't look right in a show (there are housings available to make them look stock) but otherwise it fills the bill nicely. It's about $112 on Amazon, a lot more locally if you can find it (my local stores had batteries that had been sitting for years so get a fresh one). No trickle charge, still starts right up at 40 degrees after sitting 3 weeks. There are long threads on old car forums with owners saying they are getting 5 years and more out of these batteries, with them often going all winter without a trickle charge. It's an entirely new technology.
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I've been on the road and missed the question about size of the battery. I'll check when I get home and tell you. I bought it at Autozone. The car starts beautifully and on the occasion when I flood it it has the cranking amps to start.
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i would like to see how you ran your alternator maybe take a pic for us,,,i just started rewiring mine and am switching to 12 volts,,,it is wild how much quicker it starts now....