Muntz Kaiser Pickup

[Gordie]

.................. and new members such as Bob G may not want to go down that road again.............

Just curious, how many years (or post counts) does someone need to not be "new" around here?

Don't pay any attention to the names we get depending on how many posts we have.  No one really looks or cares and for some of us it is a little embarrassing to be called a "Hero" member.  The forum is interesting and fun and has gotten to be a very popular part of our activities.

[frankies frazer]

Well we have been over this before and the two pickups that were found are in fact Muntz trucks. Proven facts.
The original title on the Frazer says PICKUP
The original tags and numbers put it with Muntz dealerships
I can go on but will just piss you guys off

[Gordie]

We have been through this discussion for years and no one has ever come up with any conclusive evidence that Muntz ever made any pick-ups and Muntz was out of Kaiser-Frazer when these pickups were home made by several owners over the years from wrecked cars.  Please read about them in several pages of this forum.

[Roadmaster49]

Well we have been over this before and the two pickups that were found are in fact Muntz trucks. Proven facts.
The original title on the Frazer says PICKUP
The original tags and numbers put it with Muntz dealerships
I can go on but will just piss you guys off

Frankie
1st, no one should probably say anything definitive about the pickups and who made them.  I am fascinated by the subject and as Gordie noted, one should read all the past threads on this one.  There are some photos, there is some documentation but never any Muntz related documents or photos. 

I mean you can believe what you want.  Not going to upset me.  Factory never made any pickups. Therefore, for me, any converted cars are custom.  Source is not that important to me.  Quality of craftmanship would be.  The reason I like the one 48 Frazer pickup recently discussed is the craftsmanship and that it is based on a Frazer.  It's got some period cues as well.

[kaiserfrazerlibrary]

I would like Frankie to post his factory documentation or documentation on the letterhead of Muntz motors to prove his claim that two trucks found were Muntz built.  The 1978 National had a documented Muntz truck there.  It was based on KAISER not FRAZER body and cowl. 

Frankie should note that there is a lot of mis-information out there about special vehicles including K-F trucks.  At least some of the mis-iunformation comes from sellers of these vehicles in the past who, it turned out didn't know themselves what the real pedigre was but assumed Muntz because nobody else came forward about other vehicles.

[Aeroman]

There was an article in an old car hobby magazine (Cars & Parts or maybe Car Classics or Car Collector) back in the 1970's about a Muntz-built Kaiser pick-up truck. The one page article showed a picture or two and described it as having a Pontiac straight eight under the hood. It was a 1949-1950 Kaiser with a separate pickup bed (not Ranchero-style "unibody") and a tailgate that said KAISER.
This same truck was once owned by Jim Davies in the Atlanta area and was sold after he died in the 1980's or early 1990's. I saw the truck once. It was white at the time and had thick spoke wheels on it.
John Parker told me many years ago that he once did work on this truck when it was a car. When he examined the truck once (I think at a KFOC National), he found some welding that he recognized as his own work underneath. He did that welding work in the 1960's or 1970's (I can't remember) which means it was NOT a truck (still a car) at the time Muntz supposedly converted it (late 1940's).
That's all I know about one truck, I cannot speak for any of the other Kaiser or Frazer trucks that may be out there. I just think every one of them is pretty cool and should be restored as pick-up trucks and shared with the rest of us.
And Frankie, no one will get pissed off - we just want truth and documentation. If it's real, great. If it's not, so what? It's still pretty cool.

[G.B. (All Vinyl Dragon)]

I was in South Gate as a Kid. We had K F then & Now. I'm not seeing when the Dealer Moved to Long Beach ?

My Dad always thought about doing this it to His 47 &  turn it into a Truck. So I know now he would of had to see this one. But knew its good to keep original even then.

This was We got the 53 All Vinyl Dragon...

[Gordie]

I bought the original photos and a inter-office memo signed by Henry J. Kaiser Jr. who was the manager of the Long Beach Kaiser-Frazer plant on November 22, 1948 and sent to Edgar F. Kaiser.  The memo says  "Enclosed is the information and photographs of a pick-up presently being used by David J. Chavis, our South Gate dealer.  This has created no end of comment and is of great use to him, not only from an advertising standpoint but as a useful standpoint,too.  It is nothing but a wrecked Kaiser which was rebuilt by Voltaire Motors in San Diego.  Voltaire is an extinct Kaiser Frazer dealer in San Diego,  I thought you would be interested."  There are seven professional photos of the truck and it was very well done but this is at the end of 1948 and after Earl Muntz sold his K-F distributorships.  There are examples of several early Kaisers converted this way and even a Frazer and owners continued to do this even in the fifties and later  They are mostly good looking conversions and fun vehicles to own.  There is still not a shred of evidence that Earl Muntz ever had anything to do with any of them.  Old rumors are hard to put to rest.

[kaiserfrazerlibrary]

Hotrod custom job. 

[Roadmaster49]

What's important to note about "Frankie" is he has not been back on.  What the Internet refers to as a troll. This forum is more forgiving than most.  A car forum these days is simply leisure enjoyment of topical issues, some more relevant than others - or it's available to relay meet information. 

[Gordie]

Our forum has been very useful for answering questions about Kaiser-Frazer cars and K-F history as well.  Although we will never know everything about Kaisers and Frazers we still have members who were there when the cars were built and worked in dealerships in the day.  We are very lucky to have these people as members and using their knowledge to answer our questions has been very helpful.  Now that the club has guidelines on each Kaiser-Frazer product it is much easier to restore our cars to as close to original as possible.  Probably the most difficult to find is original style upholstery materials as there were so many types used over the ten years of production.  If you have questions about your car ask your questions on the forum and you will get authentic answers and we all learn from your questions.

[G.B. (All Vinyl Dragon)]

Gordie,
 
Well said. I remind New Members to studie example Last Onslaught. Plus We have many more that Club Members Books that studied Our Brand thats very good. Wonderful Club Historian, & many more. Members like Hansen working with SMS on the Vinyls & more. 

Plenty of Help for New Members. Our Club has always been Friendly ready to Help.

[MarkH]

What's important to note about "Frankie" is he has not been back on.  What the Internet refers to as a troll. This forum is more forgiving than most.  A car forum these days is simply leisure enjoyment of topical issues, some more relevant than others - or it's available to relay meet information.

Well, maybe "troll" isn't quite that good of a fit.
When I was young, and accurate info was more scarce in the "print" era, I thought my leftover '53/'54 Aero Lark had to be rare...... and naturally increasingly valuable! These days of course, most anyone that's informed would know that even a professional paint job on one would put you hopelessly upside down.
If a guy did a very costly full resto on what he thought was a rare factory prototype......... thinking Barret-Jackson values..... and then LATER running into solidly conflicting info........... it might just take a bit to adjust to it's real value..