Help with VIN number on 1951 Henry J

[DylanFan]

I called the seller of the 1951 Henry J that I bought but have not taken possession of yet.  I needed the VIN number for the insurance.  She gave me a 7 digit number but that sounds small to me.  the number starts with 304.  Does that sound like a VIN number?  If not what should the VIN number look like?

Thanks

Steve Moll
Owensboro KY

[Fid]

The number you mention sounds like the engine number which some states use. The actual VIN number will begin with K514x-xxxxxx and it's located between the driver's side door hinges. Open the door and for the tag between the hinges- that's the actual VIN tag. The motor number is on the tag that's on the passenger side of the engine and it's also stamped into the block.

[DylanFan]

The number you mention sounds like the engine number which some states use. The actual VIN number will begin with K514x-xxxxxx and it's located between the driver's side door hinges. Open the door and for the tag between the hinges- that's the actual VIN tag. The motor number is on the tag that's on the passenger side of the engine and it's also stamped into the block.

Thanks!  So, if the current title lists the VIN as the seven digit number, then that's the number that I should give to the insurance company when I apply for insurance?  I'll give them a call and see if they will accept that number.

[Jim B PEI]

Just to clarify, Fid is spot on about the number. However, it is a serial number if you want to be precise, as VINs didn't come into effect for a couple of decades after demise of Studebaker, Kaiser and Frazer. This is why the serial number will tell you the year and model type, and in the HJ/Allstate, the engine as well 4 cyl or 6 cyl, but it actually won't tell you anything more about how the car was built/fitted up. That information, what there is of it, showing the paint codes, trim codes, type of transmission installed at the factory, where it was built, and accessory group, is on the body tag on the cowl.

Unlike Studebaker, where there are still 'some' of the factory records for some of the production 1935-1966, KF doesn't have anything like that so it is sometimes a guess whether or not some option was factory/dealer fitted or added to the car later. That is, unless you are lucky to have the original bill of sale/trade. With Studebakers, IF it was titled using the engine number instead of the serial number, at least it cross-references it to the serial number as well (should the engine have been changed sometime in the past)

[kaiserfrazerlibrary]

Are we talking the street rod or the stock-looking HJ; you've posted pictures of two cars.    Having lived in Cave City for several years (while Ken-Dec was in business-I was Quality Manager there) I am somewhat familiar with KYDOT and they tend to go with engine number.  If the car you are talking about is the street rod, your engine number (assuming there is a V-8 under the hood) will be radically different from the engine numbers most people here deal with.  You need to make sure that the ID number on the title matches either the engine serial number or some other number of significance on the car (a typical HJ number would look something like K513 - 0022567; starting point 0001001 going up into the mid 40,000 range). 

[DylanFan]

Are we talking the street rod or the stock-looking HJ; you've posted pictures of two cars.    Having lived in Cave City for several years (while Ken-Dec was in business-I was Quality Manager there) I am somewhat familiar with KYDOT and they tend to go with engine number.  If the car you are talking about is the street rod, your engine number (assuming there is a V-8 under the hood) will be radically different from the engine numbers most people here deal with.  You need to make sure that the ID number on the title matches either the engine serial number or some other number of significance on the car (a typical HJ number would look something like K513 - 0022567; starting point 0001001 going up into the mid 40,000 range).

The car is basically stock.  The previous owner removed the front bumper and grill and then added the gas tank on the front for looks only.  He also did all the body work on the car and then had it primed in flat black to look like a Gasser.  I am trying to decide if I want to modify the car or just put it back to stock.  I have all the original front end for the car.  It's the same car.  Some pictures are of the stock car before he started working on it and some are after it was modified.  That gas tank is bolted to a frame that is just bolted to the car so it is easy to remove it and put the stock front end back on it.

[retired wrench]

If you chop up something like this I hope your wife has PMS for two weeks twice a month. Put it back stock and enjoy it.