exhaust pipe routing

[kfnut]

trying to install a new exhaust system on a 52 J with 6 cylinder . Bought a system from Klasskolections a few months back in anticipation of getting it installed as i put the car back together . Got the engine and some of the other items in yesterday . After church , i went out to start the exhaust . I see no way it is going to fit the way it is bent . The only picture i can find where the pipe is installed is in the shop manual and it is a top shot looking down on the system . It appears it is on top of the tranny crossmember . It looks as if it will be in the way of the shifter linkage , overdrive solenoid and pitman arm . Does anyone have a photo of the pipe in this area or advice on how to get it in ? Thanks in advance for your help.
Michael

[Fid]

The one thing I can think of right off hand is did you specify the exhaust system was a for a 6 cylinder Henry J when you purchased it? The front pipe (from manifold to muffler) is totally different from a 4 cylinder to a 6 and they do not interchange. This is what the four cylinder style looks like - high and curved back at the top -

Here's the closest thing I have to a full picture of one used on the 6 cylinder J.
I took this shot under my '52 J last year when I was replacing the steering sector seal.

Here's another shot, the pitman arm is off but you can see where the pipe routes -

I was doing some work under Edgar Kaiser's Henry J last summer and I took some photos then too. Here's how it looks a bit farther back -

It is a tight pinch routing it over that crossmember but that's what needs to be done and it can be done (I've done it a couple of times) so don't give up!

[kfnut]

Yes i did specify 6 cyl. when ordering the pipe . I thought it should go over the crossmember but it sure looks tight . I might have to drop the crossmember to get it in even if the pipe is bent right .

[Fid]

Just curious, did you purchase it from the seller on ebay?  I need one for my '53 J which has a cracked one. I looked at those that were for sale on ebay and found them very suspect but I don't remember why. I just know I wasn't confident in purchasing one. Anyway, you're right, it's a very tight fit in there. I think I fed it through from behind, flipped over, then flipped it back over when I got it forward enough. Unfortunately, that was a few  years ago and I have forgotten what all I did.  I just know I was able to get it in and out without dropping the cross member. It's up to you how you feel comfortable doing it.  Best of luck.

[AZ_HJ]

I purchased a exhaust pipe off the guy on eBay for my 6 Cylinder Henry J and it was not right. I also purchased one from Kanter and had to send my old one to them for a pattern. It was much closer but it still did not work. I was able to find a good used on from a HJ Gasser guy. That one fit. The bends on the 6 cylinder are very critical. If they are off a little it does not fit.

Note: This is my experiences and may not be the same for you.

[Fid]

I've heard the same Mark. That front pipe is actually 1 5/8" and the repros are always 1 1/2" inch dia - it may not sound like a big difference but it is a difference and I figure the engineers designed it that way for a reason so I've steered clear of the 1 1/2" dia pipes.  The bends are critical and complicated and I too ended up getting a piece for one from Tom Britanyac back '01 and cut my old 4 cylinder pipe and had them welded together. The shop could not do the bends needed, even using 1 1/2" pipe so I was lucky to find what I found at the time.  Anyone else have any experiences to share?

[51HJ]

I'm in the process in trying to locate an exhaust system and have called that  Klasskollection. He tells me that the header pipe is made from 1 3/4" tubing. That it fits ! So I really don't want to waist anymore money.

[AZ_HJ]

Kanter did make it out of the right diameter pipe. It just did not 'snake' through all where it needed to very well. I tried to make it work and was very unsuccessful. I did it with the body off and had plenty of room to work so that was not the issue. I spent ALOT of money only to get the free used pipe that worked. I hope the others working on their exhaust pipes have better luck and do not spend lots of money doing it. The exhaust pipe, muffler, and tail pipe assembly has been the MOST frustrating part of my body off restoration.


FYI: Larry Braker has some 4 Cylinder NOS HJ Exhaust Pipes, but no 6 Cylinder ones.

[Fid]

I'd go with one of the four cylinder types and have it cut and weld a new piece on the manifold end. That's what I did on my '52 Vagabond when I converted it from a four to a six... hence that picture of the pipe in front of the car with the hacksaw laying there.  I did not cut the pipe myself. I took it to a shop, with the piece I got from Britanyak and the guy  there hung it in the car (he had a hoist of course) and measure / cut / welded it and it turned out perfect. In fact, the front exhaust pipe hanger covers the weld so you can't even see it. Here's a picture -

You can see the weld between the pitman arm and the hanger. If I tip the hanger down, you can't see it all.

[kfnut]

I BOUGHT THE PIPE FROM KLASSKOLLECTION OFF EBAY A FEW MONTHS AGO ANTICIPATING PUTTING IT IN WHEN I GOT TO THAT POINT IN THE RE-ASSEMBLE OF THE CAR . IT IS 1 1/2 INCH IN DIAMETER AND FROM WHAT I HAVE SEEN SO FAR IT WILL NOT FIT . I AM GOING TO DISCONNECT EVERYTHING AND DROP THE CROSSMEMBER A LITTLE AND SEE IF IT WILL GO IN . BUT I DON'T THINK IT WILL WORK . THE SHOP MANUAL SAYS TO CUT THE PIPE SO MANY INCHES FROM THE EXHAUST MANIFOLD AND ADD A COUPLING TO RE-CONNECT IT . I DON'T LIKE THAT IDEA AND WOULD RATHER GO TO THE EXTRA TROUBLE TO DROP THE CROSSMEMBER . THE PIPE THAT CAME OUT WAS A JURY RIG FROM WAY BACK IN TIME , BUT IT WORKED AND I MAY HAVE ONE BENT LIKE IT . AGAIN I THANK EVERYONE FOR THEIR INPUT AND WOULD LIKE MORE IF SOMEONE HAS ANY .

[Fid]

I will just add that dropping the cross member is not that big of a deal really. You just need to support the engine. Remove the rear (trans) mount bolts, the master cylinder mount bolts and if I remember correctly you do have to take out a cotter pin on the master cylinder.  In any case, it's pretty easy to see what needs to be done when you get under it. I think I left the parking brake cable attached because it would allow the member to lower enough that I could do what I needed to do. You'll have to make that call when you get there but it's not too bad really.

[Corsairdeluxe]

Just a few words in defense of the exhaust pipe fabricators. The factory installed the pipe before the engine, with not a thought toward its eventual replacement. I have paid my dues in trying to install an O.E.M. one piece exhaust pipe. Until I personally witness it, I do not believe it can be done! I had to cut it, install the two pieces and then weld it back together. Klass offers two different exhaust pipes, a one piece and a two piece. Why do you think they do that ??

[51HJ]

I just called John at Klasskollection. And was told that they make the 2 piece header. If you have the body on the frame and engine installed you will need to buy the 2 piece header.  Now the tail pipe is a 2 piece also because of the shipping cost if it was 1 piece.

[Fid]

Now I'm confused - I definitely had the pipe off of my 6 cylinder, '53 J back in '06 when I needed the pipe patched. I brought it to the shop and asked the guy to weld about a a 2" piece on the end for me. He would not do it and insisted I bring the whole car so he could be sure what he did worked. I remember bringing the car in that afternoon and he raised it on the hoist and patched it for me. Maybe I dropped the cross member when I removed the pipe but I'm quite sure I didn't...  Anyway, it's not worth arguing about but I am confused!  Maybe my imagination is filling in where my memory can't...

[AZ_HJ]

It's the sh_ts getting old isn't Fid.