Author Topic: Frazer Boys in a Long Sleep?  (Read 3210 times)

dragondust

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Frazer Boys in a Long Sleep?
« on: February 10, 2019, 06:52:47 PM »
I keep looking for new postings on my favorite K-F-W product, the magnificent Frazers. Are all of our owners asleep? I did not see one Frazer automobile at the most recent national meet either! I moved heaven and earth to attend for one day, and lo, there was not a single one of Joe's cars present. Just trying to stir the Frazer pot...

G.B. (All Vinyl Dragon)

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Re: Frazer Boys in a Long Sleep?
« Reply #1 on: February 10, 2019, 08:34:04 PM »
What Meet did You Go to ?
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dragondust

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Re: Frazer Boys in a Long Sleep?
« Reply #2 on: February 11, 2019, 04:24:46 PM »
McMinville, TN--the most recent national meet close enough for me.

G.B. (All Vinyl Dragon)

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Re: Frazer Boys in a Long Sleep?
« Reply #3 on: February 11, 2019, 09:00:58 PM »
It’s in Texas This Year. Hope You can come.
Research on All Vinyl Dragons & Dragon List.
G.B. Bonham LM  K.F.O.C. Club.
Also: Vintage Electronics, TV, Stereo, Radio, & Broadcasting.
Looking for Kaye Halbert TV, 27 inch screen mid 50's
made in Culver City, Calif.

JFerriss

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Re: Frazer Boys in a Long Sleep?
« Reply #4 on: February 11, 2019, 10:35:26 PM »
I am like dragondust in that I too look for interesting tidbits on Frazers. Currently I don’t have a KF car, but I really enjoyed my 1951 Frazer Manhattan hardtop for years. It was a great road car that I drove long distances. I sometimes feel the first gen KF cars are under appreciated. I feel they had fine build quality. My Frazer’s luxury and ride engineering was comparable to a 1953 Chrysler Imperial that my brother and I owned years ago. I also enjoyed my 1951 Kaiser Golden Dragon and my 1953 Kaiser Manhattan but my 1951 Frazer Manhattan hardtop was in a class by itself.

G.B. (All Vinyl Dragon)

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Re: Frazer Boys in a Long Sleep?
« Reply #5 on: February 12, 2019, 02:42:53 AM »
You’re right on the Smoth Ride in Early Years.

The Wheelbase 1947-1950 was 123.5 inch, 1951 on it was 118.5 inch that gives You a Smoth Ride.

1970-1979 Lincoln Wheelbase was 128.9 inch, Cadillac Feetwood was 130 inch. It gives You the rides like a sled feel. Weight would be the Next help for a Smooth Ride. That come easy with a Frame for Protection.
« Last Edit: February 12, 2019, 02:47:55 AM by G.B. (All Vinyl Dragon) »
Research on All Vinyl Dragons & Dragon List.
G.B. Bonham LM  K.F.O.C. Club.
Also: Vintage Electronics, TV, Stereo, Radio, & Broadcasting.
Looking for Kaye Halbert TV, 27 inch screen mid 50's
made in Culver City, Calif.

Doc

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Re: Frazer Boys in a Long Sleep?
« Reply #6 on: February 12, 2019, 04:25:19 PM »
McMinnville, Tn.?  Last year the KFOCI national convention was in Kingsport, Tn. and there were reportedly no Frazers there. Only other KFOCI meet I recollect in Tennessee was Nashville in 1994 and there were quite a few Frazers at that meet.
'54 Manhattan
'54 Late Special
'51 Frazer sedan

jake

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Re: Frazer Boys in a Long Sleep?
« Reply #7 on: February 12, 2019, 08:49:27 PM »
Here is Doc Bradley car..
EX- Member #7416 

NO Club.. 

Just a lone wolf..

G.B. (All Vinyl Dragon)

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Re: Frazer Boys in a Long Sleep?
« Reply #8 on: February 12, 2019, 11:16:20 PM »
Yes,
Remember that One.
Research on All Vinyl Dragons & Dragon List.
G.B. Bonham LM  K.F.O.C. Club.
Also: Vintage Electronics, TV, Stereo, Radio, & Broadcasting.
Looking for Kaye Halbert TV, 27 inch screen mid 50's
made in Culver City, Calif.

dragondust

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Re: Frazer Boys in a Long Sleep?
« Reply #9 on: February 16, 2019, 04:57:50 PM »
Sorry, I meant KINGSPORT. I was able to see a good friend at the meet who drove over from McMinville. I got my locations mixed up! In any event, it was a Frazer-Less convention. Texas will just be too far this year, but I will look forward to reading about the proceedings.

Gordie

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Re: Frazer Boys in a Long Sleep?
« Reply #10 on: February 16, 2019, 06:49:24 PM »
There were no Frazers but there were three rare Allstate's so we had lots of fun cars to look at.  I'll bet that there will be Frazers at Granbury.  It is pretty close to the center of the US.
Member #3151 Since June 1974
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'47 Graham Paige Frazer                                   
'51 Kaiser Deluxe club coupe       
'51 Kaiser customized convertible 
'52 Allstate serial#39
'53 Aero Eagle
'54 Aero Eagle Custom

dragondust

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Re: Frazer Boys in a Long Sleep?
« Reply #11 on: February 17, 2019, 06:47:29 PM »
Yes, I was very surprised to see the Allstates! Don't get me wrong, there were some lovely Kaisers and plenty of my favorite--the 54/55's to feast my eyes upon.

Gordie

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Re: Joe Frazer discussed in Classic Car Magazine
« Reply #12 on: February 23, 2019, 06:24:15 PM »
The newest issue of Classic Car magazine was just received in my mailbox and there is an interesting one page article by Patrick Foster about the loss of Joe Frazer and the Frazer car and the decline of sales for Kaiser-Willys Corporation.  It is well known that Henry Kaiser did not take advice from his partner and Kaiser relegated Frazer to a meaningless job and built '51 Frazer's only to use up leftover '50 bodies that were in inventory in spite of Frazer's warnings to not over produce in 1949 and '50.  To Kaisers surprise the new '51 Frazer was a hit and the company had over 55,000 orders on hand and of course had to end production when they ran out of bodies.  The 1951 Kaisers were very popular for a year or so  and then slowed down and Kaiser could no longer depend on the sales of Frazer's to bolster the production numbers.  Did that hurt Kaiser sales?  Patrick Foster thinks so and you may enjoy the article in the April 2019 issue.
Member #3151 Since June 1974
Vice President K.F.O.C.I. 2013-2017  President 2018-2019
'47 Graham Paige Frazer                                   
'51 Kaiser Deluxe club coupe       
'51 Kaiser customized convertible 
'52 Allstate serial#39
'53 Aero Eagle
'54 Aero Eagle Custom

kaiserfrazerlibrary

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Re: Frazer Boys in a Long Sleep?
« Reply #13 on: February 24, 2019, 09:56:41 AM »
When Kaiser-Frazer told the stockholders in January 1947 it planned to acquire the Frazer car operations of Graham-Paige, they said that Frazer production would be dictated by dealer/distributor orders rather than the ratio of 2 Kaisers to 1 Frazer.  1947 Production was nearly 50/50 Kaiser and Frazer cars which further supports the policy shift.  As the competition got back to full production the Frazer became a tough sell for the dealer network.  By 1949, the Frazer was outclassed in a number of respects compared to the other cars in the upper medium price field.   For the price of a basic Standard F495 Frazer (MSRP) you could get an Oldsmobile or even a base-line Packard with automatic transmission and an 8 cylinder engine.  The distribution system only ordered what they could sell.  Around 40% of all Kaiser and Frazer cars built in calendar year 1949 were Kaiser Travelers and the 4,500 or so Kaiser Vagabonds. 

Orders for the 1951 Frazer reflected a couple things that were particular to the production run.  First, the price of parts for the car reflected inventory write-downs.  Any additional cars built after the actual run would have to be priced as much as $200.00 or so higher.  Second, K-F was interested in using up vast stocks of leftover cars and major items (work in process on the assembly line, pre-cut interior fabrics, etc) at minimal loss.  The cars were not priced to make money for the company.  Any additional cars built after the actual run would have to be priced to be profitable.  My numbers come from company Operating Reports from the period of March 31, 1950 through October 31, 1950.  Hundreds of dollars were lost on each Frazer produced as 1951 models. 

My estimates on selling prices for a 1951 Frazer F515 standard 4-door sedan put this car (6 cylinder, and without overdrive) above the price of a base-line Cadillac with V-8 engine and automatic transmission.  Do you think that dealers could have sold them in large numbers under conditions like that? 

For more info on this, checy BUILT TO BETTER THE BEST in the section that covers the start of the 1951 K-F model year.  The company felt the future lay in a lower-priced, dressed-up car like the Nash Rambler.  Hudson, Studebaker and even Packard agreeed rolling out a lower-priced version of the mainline product (Pacemaker and Hudson Jet, Champion and  the Scottsman, along with the Clipper). 

Rchilds

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Re: Frazer Boys in a Long Sleep?
« Reply #14 on: February 28, 2019, 04:41:52 PM »
No sleep for the weary here.   I am getting my 48 Manhattan back together.  Had dropped the rebuilt engine in with most things attached.. When I went to attach the exhaust pipe,both manifold studs were loose so I  had to pull the manifolds again,drill out the holes and install helicoils.   Yesterday, I reinstalled the radiator so now I'm down mostly to wiring.  Bob McBride made me a lovely OD harness which needs installation, then a couple battery cables, a new battery , a load of oil and coolant and I should be ready for prime time.  I have noticed that my rear springs  are sagging, so will have to have them re-arced once I get it on the road.   I'm excited to get it out for Spring. 

Rich