Headliner

[Logan]

The headliner in my 53 Dragon is coming down in two places right over my head.  It is not torn, and is in good condition.  When I feel up there I can move two bars, one behind each seam, but as I do not know how it was installed, I don't know if there is an "easy" fix or not.  I really don't know anything about this, but is there anything that can be done short of pulling it all out (which I would not do myself)?

[mow4alivn]

Logan,
   I just removed my headliner in my 53 manhattan last week what I seen was the headliner is in strips going across the car from one side to the other as all the older cars were done this way. These strips are cut at angles to conform the to top of the car then sewn together but before they are sewn there is a piece of folded over piece of material placed between each seam for a metal rod that hold your headliner up and tight. Kind of like a house curtain would have where you run a curtain rod though a curtain that you would have in your home. Sounds to me like the folded material has torn inside probably due to old age and the rod in protruding through the top of the folded material thus letting the headliner fall down. I'm thinking not much you can do to fix it unless you pull the headliner out and have it fixed with new material (the folded material that is).   

[Logan]

Well, unfortunately, that's what I thought.  The clincher is that all the upholstery in there is in really good shape, and I hate to mess anything up.  Also, I plan on doing a restoration on this car at some point in the future (engine and chasis, new seat inserts at least, new paint, chrome, and gold-plate).  So, maybe I just have to live with this for now.  Thanks for the expertise info.

[Orphanauto]

I did auto uphostery in college for a few years just to learn and do my Studebaker, Hudson, ect.. A headliner is VERY easy to replace, takes alittle time, but not a all day job, the problem you are having is what was said, the strip of material going thru the bow has ripped, I have the same problem in my 55 Packard, I was thinking about getting a little bottle of super glue, with the needle, and poking in in the material and holding it up to the bow for a quick dry, just to do a quick fix to see if that would work, as I don't want to replace the headliner at this time. I'll try that, and let you know what happens, may be a few weeks though. But, I heard the material for the headliner is now being reproduced, and putting a new one in, is not hard at all. I will be glad to help you out on info, or if you live close to me, I'll do it for you, as you can sit back and chat old car stuff while i do it.

[mow4alivn]

Hey Orphanauto
    The stuff that is in the groove on each side of the headliner where you would staple the headliner material and rope looking material. Mine is 1/2 by 1/2 roughly what is that stuff made of? Looks like  maybe a hard cardboard material. 

[Logan]

Orphanauto, I'm in Texas--I'm not sure where you are.  I wonder if it is separated, because I can feel the rods, which seem like they themselves are hangin down.  Is it possible that the material is still connected to the rods, but they have somehow moved out of there place?  If so, can they be pushed back up?  I admit I have tried to push them back upthrough the headliner to no effect, so perhaps this is not it.  It's not annoying until I am driving on the freeway with the windows down and wind gets under the headliner and pushes it against my head.

[Orphanauto]

Mow4aliving,, The material that runs along side the headliner is called the windlace, it is very easy to replace too, provided, you have the headliner out. You really can't do it without taking the headliner out, so, IF you are going to replace the headliner, thats the time to replace the windlace. The material should be soft, but after 50 plus years, most of them have became as hard as a rock. some, start to disinicrate inside turning to dust. oh, by the way, it's made out of a soft foam type of material covered by cloth. Logan, I'm in the south west part of Mo. between Joplin and Springfield. Yes, the material of the Headliner is sewn from 6-7 peices with a strip of material about 1/2 inch circle in between each piece, these 1/2 inch circles then are used to slid the rods that go from the left to right of the car to hold it up. The 1/2 in material has spilt, and therefore your headliner is hanging down. The headlinr can be pulled out and repaired, but that might be a tricky thing to do. Since there seems to be a big interest in this, perhaps I can take pictures, and do a little article for the club in the KF monthly. If anyone has questions on uphosltery, I would be glad to help, I do not do this for a living, I am a over the road truck driver, but did this in college to do my cars, and enjoyed it, therefore, part of the injoyment of the clubs to me is learning from you guys on the technical, ect, I'll help with what I can. Anyway, if ANYONE had any quesions, you may call me at 417-350-5851 Ron... this is my cell, www.orphanauto.webs.com

[darrin145]

Hi Guys - If I can jump in here, I believe what mow4alivn is asking about is the tack strip. The "rope" like material which the headliner and windlace staple to. It does become junk after a period of time. The 21st century remedy is tack strip made from neoprene or some such material. I've used it in my last few restorations and it is far superior to the old style material. Check with your local upholstery shop, I'm sure they'll have it in stock. That's my story and I'm sticking to it, of course, your mileage may vary!!

Gary.

[Logan]

Orphanauto, I'll bet there would be a lot of interest if you did an article in the monthly.  Upholstery and paint are the two things I'm scared of.  I don't mind tackling the mechanicals.  Thanks everyone for the advice, I think it will have to hang for a while until I get ready to do the rest of the interior--at one point someone replaced the seat inserts with a plain white vinyl, so I would like to get the original style patterned laguna cloth, which I hear SMS is planning on producing (or are they currently producing it?).

[mow4alivn]

Thanks darrin145, you were right thats what I was asking about.

OK, Now with that question answered. There is a person on ebay selling headliners, seat recovering, and custom fit carpeting for Kaisers. I believe they are located in canada. Has anyone ever used their items for your kaisers? If so did they look and fit good?

Thanks, mow4alivn

[Orphanauto]

Hey Mow, sorry if I miss understood what you were asking about. I don't know about the place in Canada, but I have bought a few headliners from a place in Long Beach California, they are a big compnay that makes them for J.C. Whitney, and just about anybody. I had some made for a Studebaker Starlight coupe, as well as for a Lark. I would buy it from SMS IF you want the origianl material, as I heard they are now making the original boucle material, opps, I think I miss spelled that, haha, anyway, I am an all original type guy, so IF you are going original, well, that's what I would do. Also, IF you need help putting it in, you can call me with any questions, and I'll try to tell you how to do it. It really is very easy. Perhaps, when I get a chance to do the article, I'll try to post here as well, and post pictures. My 53 Manhattan only has 47,500 miles, and my headliner is original, and like new, so, I may have to do my Lark for the article, or something. IF anyone in my area needs theirs done, I will do the labour for free to use for pictures for the article. oh, by the way, you can almost always get a little bit extra material so you can have the visors done in the same material when you order the headliner. 

[Logan]

And if you have a Dragon the headliner is the same bamboo vinyl that is on the seats, which SMS also reproduces I hear.

[Logan]

Okay, I was feeling up behind the headliner today and I can definitely tell that the metal rods are somehow out of place, as they are nearly touching my head.  In fact, it is possible that the vinyl loops are still intact and only the bars have come out of position.  Would this still require taking the headlinger out?  I was trying to shove them around, but didn't want to go too far and rip the headliner or something.

[superk226]

The headliner on my 53 Dragon come down too. The loops in the material that the rods went through were not torn. The reason it came down was that rubber grommets that the rods sit deteriorate over time and do not hold the rods tight. I turned the rods to the correct position and put a sheet metal screw in the hole beside the rod to hold it in place. This repair was done six or seven years ago and it is still okay. The hard part of this repair was to put the wind lace back in place.

[Logan]

That's what I'm concerned about.  I have no experience whatever in upholstery and am very nervous about tearing windlace/headliner, not being able to get it back in, etc.  Thanks for confirming the problem.  If I get brave I may try this method.